1841 Look Up Please CLARK

[MudgeeClarke]

****UPDATED AT POST #15****

Seeking any details on (first) William CLARK(E) in 1841 in Cambridge, possibly Bourn, and (second) James CLARK(E), vicinity St. Pancras, London.

Need to know if there is a William, with an Elisabeth or an Elizabeth (HANCOCK) in Cambridge, or a James with Elizabeth/Eliza (HANCOCK) in London, either family with a son Richard CLARK b. c 1831

I am searching for details of my Great Grandfather, Richard CLARK(E), who sailed to Australia 1857, married there, and died 1912. We have no firm knowledge of his birthplace or date, except it is recorded that his mother was "Eliza HANCOCK".

((I have been told there are records of a Richard born 1831 in Bourn, Cambridge, and a Richard born 1831 nr St Pancras, London, both with mother Eliza(beth).))

My first post since registering ... Thank you.

*****PLEASE READ POST No.15 for AN UPDATE *****

 

[Sunscreen]

Hi

found this entry in the 1841 Census

William Clark age 30 (born Bourn) agr. labourer
Elizabeth Clark age 30 Wife
Jamima Clark age 11 Daughter
Richard Clark age 9 Son
William Clark age 7 Son
Biddy Clark age 5 Daughter
Elizabeth Clark age 3 Daughter
Charles Clark age 1 Son
Thomas Marchell age 55 ?

No address only Bourne, Cambridgeshire:


Pat

 

[Sunscreen]

Hi again

They appear again in ther 1851 census (except Biddy, Jamima & Thomas Marchell) with the following address:

26 Arms Hill, Cambridgeshire

William snr, Richard & William jr all Agricultural labourers

 

[Sunscreen]

Hi again

They appear again in ther 1851 census (except Biddy, Jamima & Thomas Marchell) with the following address:

26 Arms Hill, Cambridgeshire

William snr, Richard & William jr all Agricultural labourers

 

[MudgeeClarke]

Hello Pat:
Thanks so much for your quick replies and some nice detail. Who knows. Could be THE Richard. (Although I am very wary these days to assume such luck..)

I suppose the only way to tie this down a bit more is to discover the birth details c1832 for Richard esp. the baptism record, so that I can see if Elizabeth CLARK is actually the former Eliza(beth) HANCOCK?? because I presume that record will show her maiden name - is that a correct assumption?? Or maybe I have to find their marriage record at a church ?? I suppose the marriage must be around 1829-30 if Jamima was the first born and in wedlock.

Does FHUK have folks who have a look-up facility for that type of thing??

Anyway, super thank you for your reply. Impressive!

Cheers, Colin

 

[MudgeeClarke]

Hi PAt:

PS.

I see there is a 26 ALMS Hill, in Bourn, Cambridgeshire, so I think that may be the same address, yeah?

Cheers,

Colin

--

 

[MudgeeClarke]

Hi Pat:

Final comment on this one...I see that Richard of Bourn is on the 1861 census. "My" Richard sailed 1856. So, too sad, too bad. Thanks, though.

And I see that the Elizabeth in the Old Church St Pancras is an Elizabeth Ann Bowman. So, that's that, too. :-(

Same old same old.

Onwards and upwards.

Colin

Colin

 

[Sunscreen]

Hi

will have a good search again later - there were other Richard Clarks - I went for this one! Will try for Mother's maiden name, but not always shown on early records. Get back to you soon.

Pat

 

[susieQ]

I don't suppose this will be of much interest but I've just moved into a beautiful Vicotorian house at the top of Alms Hill (15 High Street Bourn). We are only the third owners. The house was built in 1892 for the Clark family. The two daughters, Ada and Amy, lived together in the house up until the 1980s. I have found their graves in the Bourn churchyard.

Curiously the house is named Wilgress House, itself a mystery.

Susie

 

[Ladybird1300]

Hello Susie Q

Welcome to the forum

Amanda

 

[MudgeeClarke]

Thank you, Susie Q. It is very kind of you to take the time to give me this information. Sadly, I do not think that my Richard was from Bourn. The Richard that was part of the Bourn family was still shown on the 1861 census, whereas my Richard had already sailed to Australia in Nov 1857. There is the possibility, of course, that all the Clark(e) family in the region were related in one way or another.

Again, Thank you so much. Let me know ASAP when you find an old letter behind the wallpaper during renovations, from my GGF Richard.

Cheers, Colin

 

[Ladybird1300]

Doesn't Richard's marriage certificate have his father's name on it?? I can tell you The William from Cambridgeshire was a labourer possibly an ag lab and the Richard from St Pancras was a Cheesemonger. Haven't been able to find marriages for either in the Parish records do you have the baptisms for both Richards' ??

Amanda

 

[MudgeeClarke]

Hi Amanda,

Richard is a known NPE. No baptism never located. But many other records either blank, or "father unknown". He did have a younger brother Alfred, whose baptism record exists = "father unknown" also. The family was pretty much located around Fulboirn, Cambs.

Thanks.

 

[Ladybird1300]

I don't think there are marriages for an Elizabeth Hancock in Cambridgeshire or London, they don't appear in the Pasrish records.
The only marriage I could find for William to an Elizabeth was in Chatteris:

First name(s) William
Last name Clarke
Name note -
Marriage year 1825
Marriage date 1825
Marriage place Chatteris, Cambs, Eng
Father's first name(s) -
Father's last name -
Mother's first name(s) -
Mother's last name -
Spouse's first name(s) Elizabeth
Spouse's last name Stimson
Spouse's father's first name(s) -
Spouse's father's last name -
Spouse's mother's first name(s) -
Spouse's mother's last name -
Residence Chatteris, Cambridgeshire, England
Place Chatteris
County Cambridgeshire
Country England
Record set England Marriages 1538-1973
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Marriages & divorces
Collections from Great Britain

As you can see she wasn't Hancock


And lots of marriages for James Clark/e to Elizabeths but still no Hancock


Amanda

 

[MudgeeClarke]

Oh dear, I see just now what is happening, Amanda. All my fault. I didn't realize that this thread was absent an update. I have tried to update the various places I have placed queries. I'm sorry you have been so kindly looking in the wrong corner.

The fact is that I have discovered that Richard, perhaps to hide his embarrassment of not knowing his father's name, was citing Eliza HANCOCK as his mother, whereas she was actually Eliza CLARKE the daughter of William CLARKE and Mary HANCOCK, of Fulbourn Cambs. You can easily find the marriage of William and Mary in Fulbourn, and many children including Eliza b.1810, d.1845 (married to a James HART 1839).

By using Eliza HANCOCK as mother's name, Richard well and truly threw us all off track. If I hadn't found a Cambridge Goal record for him for stealing a duck valued two shillings, I would not have found the (juicy) rest of the trail, leading to his arrival in Australia.

However, through all of this detective work, I have never been able to find a baptism record for Richard, even though it seems the entire wider family at Fulbourn all were very inclined to use Fulbourn church for all events. Even Richard's younger brother, Alfred b1836, has a baptism record "father blank".

To this end, I have taken every DNA test possible for a male, and hope to eventually get a strong enough lead to know where to direct my paper search. Some names which regularly crop up, but are not close enough for family record purposes (yet) are WILSON and BARTON.

I have started a page on Facebook which I have called The Richard Clarke Enigma hoping that someone drops in who recognizes the story. I don't rely on vague suggestions generally, but with Richard, my great grandfather, I'm looking under every stone. His family name is commonly accepted as Clarke of course, hence my name, but unless his father was indeed a Clarke (it happens), I believe our G G GF had a different name.

Again, I'm very sorry you have been looking around because of my error. I hope you haven't spent too much time on it. Feel free, of course, to find Richard's baptism record, preferably with a father's name.

Best regards,

Colin

 

[Ladybird1300]

Thanks for the update, so am I still looking in the Cambridge records?? And I'll check out your FB page, you never know something might turn up


Amanda

 

[Ladybird1300]

As promised:

First Name RICHARD
Last Name CLARK
Year Of Birth 1829
Birth date 18 Jun 30
Baptism year 1829
Baptism date 13 Sep 1829
Abode otp
Place BOURN
Mother's Given Name Eliza
Father's First Name William
Father occupation lab
Notes -
County Cambridgeshire
Record set Cambridgeshire Baptisms
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Births & baptisms
Collections from Great Britain


First Name RICHARD
Last Name CLARK
Year Of Birth 1831
Birth date 18 Jul 12
Baptism year 1831
Baptism date 23 Oct 1831
Abode otp
Place BOURN
Mother's Given Name Elizabeth
Father's First Name William
Father occupation lab
Notes -
County Cambridgeshire
Record set Cambridgeshire Baptisms
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Births & baptisms
Collections from Great Britain


This looks like the death for the second one:

First name(s) Richard
Last name Clark
Birth year 1831
Death year 1921
Age 90
Burial year 1921
Burial date 12 Nov 1921
Residence otp
Parish Bourn
County Cambridgeshire
Record set Cambridgeshire Burials
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Deaths & burials
Collections from Great Britain

Could not find a baptism for Alfred at that time


Amanda

 

[Ladybird1300]

I don't think the first one is yours either, this is him in the 1841 census:

Name: Richard Clark
Age: 11
Estimated birth year: abt 1830
Gender: Male
Where born: Cambridgeshire, England
Civil Parish: Bourn
Hundred: Longstow
County/Island: Cambridgeshire
Country: England
Street address:

Occupation:

View image
Registration district: Caxton
Sub-registration district: Caxton
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 68
Book: 2
Folio: 4
Page Number: 3
Household Members:
Name Age
William Clark 35
Eliza Clark 35
Richard Clark 11
Elizabeth Clark 9
John Clark 7
Julia Clark 4
William Clark 2
Elizabeth Clark 70


Amanda

 

[MudgeeClarke]

Re: 1841 Look Up Please CLARK(E)

Thank you so much for the efforts you have made.

Yes, I've looked at these Clark(e)s from Bourn before. The Richards there can be found in records for UK after my Richard sailed for Australia, November 1856 arriving Feb 1857, so I've discounted him at Bourn (although not the family)

It's funny that Bourn turns up when I have the FULbourn records for Clark(e) as well...

I am wondering if anyone has the Huguenot church records for Cambs, especially Cambridge/Fulbourn. From what I have read, the timeframe is about right for their presence in that area of the UK. I also have a reasonable (but not close enough yet) DNA connection in my FTDNA results for a PATRAS/PATRAY/PATREY who was a Huguenot in the UK before eventually moving to the US/Canada.

I have also read that if the French Huguenots in UK could not find their own church, they often used C of E.

Just more straws I'm grabbing.

Somewhere, there has to be a birth/baptism record for Richard - his mother baptized all the other children, and her family were church goers it seems.

Sigh.

 

[Ladybird1300]

Huguenots I know a bit about, my grandmother was a descendant from French Protestant families in London's East End. After they had been here for a generation or two, they assimilated fairly easily and as you say they used the local churches because they began to marry into the local population.
I've just put various different versions of the name in both FMP and Ancestry, but got nothing on FMP and a few in London on the other one. There is a chance that the name was Anglecised to Petrie, a few came up.
I was doing some research on the Cambridge side of my tree, and I came across a baptism at the Wallooon French protestant church Cambridgeshire, and now for the life of me I can't find it. I did a search for information about it on Google but found nothing, it probably wasn't used for many years before integration.
As for occupations, most were silk weavers, some were silversmiths others were watchmakers, they were known as Artisans. I have many cordwainers in my family, but none of them were Huguenots.
Well keep looking, I was in a Huguenot group on FB, but they couldn't leave US politics out of it so I left. I have some friends from the group, if any of them have French protestants from Cambridgeshire I'll get back to you. Of course I may come across some myself you never know.
I did a DNA test myself, but I'm still waiting for my results, in the new year I expect.

Amanda