Back and determined to get some answers.

[tinamoo]

Hi All,

I am Tina. I started doing my family tree back in 2003. I am sticking to my mums side for now. I stopped as I came to a brick wall, on that I am determined to knock down:biggrin:

Basically I am trying to find details of my great great grandfather Joseph Redding. All I have at the moment is his name and that he was a Land Steward. His son was also called Joseph Redding born 1880 in Dublin and died 1915 in the first world war. Joseph (snr) was married to Mary who I found out today :biggrin: was born in Stanley, County Queen, Ireland. She was born in 1858 and died in Newton-Le-Willows in 1914 aged 53. I know by this time she was widowed.

I cannot find Joseph (snr) and Mary in the 1881 census. Their son Joseph was living with an Eleanor Swann in Cambridge and is listed as a visitor. I have no idea how this lady links with Joseph.

I also cannot find Joseph and Mary in the 1891 census. Once again I found Joseph their son. He is living with Eliza and Thomas Ray in Newton-Le-Willows. He is listed as nephew but unfortunately Eliza is Mary's sister. I was hoping that Thomas was Mary's brother so I would have a maiden name to search for Mary & Joseph's wedding records which would hopefully provide me with more information on Joseph.

Now that I know that Mary & Eliza were sisters, I have tried to find a wedding record for Thomas and Eliza in the hope that I may find her maiden name that way but I am having no luck there either. I know Eliza was born in 1866 in Ireland and Thomas was born 1869.

I was working on a theory that maybe Joseph (snr) died quite soon after his son Joseph was born and that Mary had to work away to provide for him. It still does not account for not being able to find Mary on the censuses.

If anyone can point me in the right direction I would be grateful. I am really happy as I have found a few bits of information that are new to me.:biggrin:

 

[juliejtp]

Hi,

Welcome to FHUK.

If I'm looking at the right people transcribed as Reddings on the site I use Mary was a widow in 1911. Joseph jnr married Minnie.

 

[juliejtp]

Hi,

The nearest I could find for a Mary Redding in 189, is a Mary Ridding born abt 1857 Ireland occ cook in the civil parish of Wallington - RD Croydon - Sub RD Mitcham. Theres a lot of Mary's born Ireland over 3000.

 

[juliejtp]

Hi,

The 1891 could be her as she is a retired cook in 1901 and widowed.

 

[tinamoo]

Hi,

The 1891 could be her as she is a retired cook in 1901 and widowed.

Thank you very much for looking for me. I will go and look it up now.

 

[davelambert271]

Hi

welcome

to the forum

according to Joseph service record his wife Minnie Chandler was an inmate in a lunatic asylum (nov 1914) He married 31/12/10 at the Reg. Office, Warrington and had three children, James 20/3/09 Illegit, Florence Mabel 20/1/11 and Mary Ellen b 22/12/12 all born Newton Le Willows U.D.
He was missing in action, presumed dead in France. His belongings were sent to his Aunt Elizabeth Southern, guardian of 30 Back Market ?, Earlestown, Lancs. Also at this address was a J Southern

dave

 

[davelambert271]

In 1911 Mary 53 is living with Joseph, Minnie James and Florence at 29 Grafton St, Earlestown, Lancs (warrington District)

dave

 

[davelambert271]

1901
Mary 46 ret cook, living with Joseph 21 at 15 Grafton St, Newton in Markerfield

 

[davelambert271]

1891
Joseph 12 nephew of Thomas 29 and Eliza 25 RAY, at 8 Derby St Newton

dave

sorry if I've duplicated info already found - dave

 

[tinamoo]

Hi

welcome

to the forum

according to Joseph service record his wife Minnie Chandler was an inmate in a lunatic asylum (nov 1914) He married 31/12/10 at the Reg. Office, Warrington and had three children, James 20/3/09 Illegit, Florence Mabel 20/1/11 and Mary Ellen b 22/12/12 all born Newton Le Willows U.D.
He was missing in action, presumed dead in France. His belongings were sent to his Aunt Elizabeth Southern, guardian of 30 Back Market ?, Earlestown, Lancs. Also at this address was a J Southern

dave

In 1911 Mary is living with Joseph, Minnie James and Florence at 29 Grafton St, Earlestown, Lancs (warrington District)

dave

Yes this is all correct. The name Southern is new to me though so thank you very much as is his exact wedding date as my mum was of the idea that they had never legally married. I always believed that they had married. Thank you for the confirmation.

 

[juliejtp]

I wonder why the Ray's changed their surname to Southern?

 

[davelambert271]

I wonder why the Ray's changed their surname to Southern?

Hi Julie = what makes you say this? I thought they were different

dave

 

[tinamoo]

I wonder why the Ray's changed their surname to Southern?

Hi Julie = what makes you say this? I thought they were different

dave

I assumed that they were different too. Eliza & Elizabeth are similar though & I was thinking along the same lines originally. The birth years are different though Eliza Ray born in Ireland 1866. Elizabeth Southern born 1856 in Burtonwood, Lancashire. Because Elizabeth is Joseph (jnr) aunt I have been trying to find her birth record unsuccessfully. If anyone is able to look that up for me.

Obviously (I hope) she will be Elizabeth Redding born 1856 in Burtonwood, Lancashire. If nothing else I am hoping to find her parents names from that.

 

[davelambert271]

1911 Thomas Southern 43 Blacksmiths Striker (same as Joseph),
Elizabeth Southern 44 Queens Co Ire - married 22 years, living 14 Peel St, Earlestown

1901 ref 3574-159-25 - not found them in 1891 yet

dave

 

[tinamoo]

So Julie was right then they did change their name from Ray to Southern.

I am trying to remember now where I found the Burtonwood as place of birth. In which case Eliza/Elizabeth are the same person and Mary's sister as Mary was born in County Queen, Ireland.

 

[juliejtp]

Sorry that my previous reply was short and not detailed. Have been having internet problems for a while and now the site I use is on maintenance.

 

[juliejtp]

I can see a Thomas Ray born abt 1869 in 1891 in Warrington. Thats putting born 1868 with 2yrs either side born Liverpool.

 

[davelambert271]

Just noticed in 1891 Thomas and Elizabeth are living next door to Mary and Joseph.
Cant find a marriage of Thomas Ray or Southern, nor can I find them on the same census - strange

dave

 

[juliejtp]

Hi,

Came across this marriage between a Joseph Redding and Mary Bachelor
Apr/May/Jun 1879 - Abbeyleix. Abbeyleix when googling came up Co. Laios Ireland. Googled Queens Couny Ireland, former name of County Laois.

 

[juliejtp]

Unless that marriage is a different couple because there is this birth in 1880.

Thomas Redding - 19 Jul 1880 - Balleen Kilkenny
Parents Joseph Redding and Mary Jane Bachelor Redding