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David SANDS 1852-1931 - Did he marry?

DaveHam9

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#1
David SANDS b. 1852 d. 1931 Randwick

#V18521121 45A/1852 SANDS DAVID WILLIAM CATHERINE A


1882 SANDS John Marshall & David Upholsterers Old South Head Rd WAVERLEY
1883 SANDS John Marshall & David Furniture Dealers Queen St WOOLLAHRA

1885 & 1886 SANDS David Tobacconist 51 Queen St WOOLLAHRA

John Marshall is David's younger brother. Can David be found after 1886?

# 1677/1931 SANDS DAVID 77 YRS RANDWICK RANDWICK --> 1854

Did he marry? Is his middle name Swan?

Marriage
1592/1891 SANDS DAVID LEIST ANNIE E SYDNEY
Death
29156/1948 SANDS ANNIE ELIZABETH EDWARD FRED HARRIETT ELIZABETH MARRICKVILLE

Can we find where they are buried?
No sign of any children born in NSW.

Thanks.

Dave
 

gedcom

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#2
This is from an Electoral Roll

David Sands
Gender: Male
Electoral Year: 1930
State: New South Wales
District: South Sydney
Subdistrict: Randwick East


There is also mentions of a David Sands in Directories, address is Carr Street Randwick. (1908

Gedcom
 

gedcom

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#3
There is this but I don't know if he is the right one

Australian Electoral Roll

John Marshall Sands
Gender: Male
Electoral Year: 1919
State: Queensland
District: Oxley
Subdistrict: Brisbane South


Also

John Marshall Sands
Gender: Male
Electoral Year: 1936
State: New South Wales
District: Lang
Subdistrict: Arncliffe


A death so probably not the same man

13011/1943 SANDS JOHN MARSHALL Father, WILLIAM Mother CATHERINE ANGUES area, ROCKDALE



Gedcom
 
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DaveHam9

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#4
Hello gedcom,

Thank you.

It is the same John Marshall. He became a Congregational Minister and was on the south coast of NSW near Milton in 1891-1896 where a son was born, in Adelaide around 1905 when a son was in Army Cadets, in the Manse Vulture St Brisbane 1915-1919 where his spouse died in 1915 and then back in the Rockdale area of Sydney.

That is his death reg with an error - it should be Catharine Angus (nee SWAN).

Regards,

Dave
 

gedcom

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#5
Hi Dave

Like you, I cannot find any more at the moment. I have just had a trawl through the Digitised Australian Newspaper site just incase. I wondered if David had an obituary when he died, it might have named his children if he had any.

Gedcom
 

crankypants

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#6
Hi Dave

Marriage
1592/1891 SANDS DAVID LEIST ANNIE E SYDNEY

1900 N.S.W Post Office Directory
SANDS David newsagent Allison road Randwick

1903 N.S.W Electoral Roll – Wentworth – Randwick-Avoca
SANDS Annie Elizabeth Allison-road home duties
SANDS David Allison-road newsagent

1904 N.S.W Post Office Directory
SANDS David Allison-rd Randwick

1936 N.S.W Electoral Roll – Watson – Randwick East
SANDS Annie Elizabeth 9 Carr street Coogee home duties
(also in 1930 with David)

New South Wales Police Gazette 1884
Woollahra – Stolen, between the hours of 12.00 and 6.00 a.m. the 23rd instant, from the shop of David Sands, tobacconist, No. 51, Queens-street, Woollahra, - Fifteen meerschaum pipes, of various shapes; nine boxes of cigars, brands “High Life’s” and “Hansa;” two dozen packets “Old Ridge” cigarettes; one large opera-glass; half-dozen white handle pocket knives; one dozen black handle ditto; and three brown handle ditto; four cigar holders; six gold pointed pencil holders; one box of “Little Beauty” cigarettes; about 30lbs. Of tobacco; and a white silk coat. Total value, pound 30.

cheers
crankypants
 
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DaveHam9

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#7
Hello gedcom,

Thanks for adding that. No sign of any children. Even though the age at death is 2 years out I'm confident that he did die in 1931 in Randwick. If I have to add that purchase of a transaction of his death to my list then I will if we can't prove it in other ways.

There is a big gap between the 1886 entry and the 1930 Electoral Roll entry.

Regards,

Dave
 

DaveHam9

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#8
Hello crankypants,

Thank you very much. I had the marriage and Annie's death and the marriage of her parents just in case we can somehow prove the tobacconist married and became a newsagent.

The curious thing is that not one of the SANDS researchers has been prepared to say he did marry Annie. And, it's rare for none of the researchers to have found his burial yet. Virtually all the SANDS burials are recorded even though they are everywhere: Prospect, Old Balmain, Devonshire St --> Botany, Northern Suburbs, Eastern Suburbs, Rookwood.

Regards,

Dave
 

DaveHam9

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#9
Hello,

Death
29156/1948 SANDS ANNIE ELIZABETH EDWARD FRED HARRIETT ELIZABETH MARRICKVILLE

Marriages Dec 1851 Middlesex
Leist Edward Frederick St Martin 1 143
Morris Harriet Eliza St Martin 1 143

Births Mar 1854
Leist Sarah Louisa Strand 1b 395

LEIST Edward 25 Lloyds 1855 Sydney and/or Newcastle and family Reel 2137, [4/4792]; Reel 2470, [4/4951]
LEIST Harriett 25 Lloyds 1855 Sydney and/or Newcastle and family
LEIST Sarah 1 Lloyds 1855 Sydney and/or Newcastle and family

Annie Elizabeth must fit in here - birth not registered ??

First of 7 born in Sydney
169/1858 LEIST EDWARD F EDWARD F HARRIET SYDNEY

Deaths
11246/1899 LEIST EDWARD F EDWARD SARAH WAVERLEY
6846/1910 LEIST HARRIETT E 79 YRS RANDWICK RANDWICK

Dave
 

crankypants

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#10
Hi Dave

This is where Annie's mother was living in 1903. Harriet Eliza LEIST with 2 daughters and daughter-in-law

1903 N.S.W Electoral Roll
Wentworth Division - Waverley Junction Polling Place

LEIST Ada Sarah 82 Ebley street domestic duties
LEIST Emily Maud 82 Ebley street domestic duties
LEIST Florence Louise 82 Ebley street domestic duties
LEIST Harriet Eliza 82 Ebley street domestic duties

Death Emily M 1919 Drummoyne
Death Florence L 1919 Randwick
Death Harriet E 1910 Randwick

1930 & 1936 N.S.W Electoral Roll – Waringah - Mosman
LEIST Ada Sarah
LEIST Frederick William

Now Annie Elizabeth SANDS death in Marrickville, why did she leave the Coogee area. No Leist deaths in Marrickville, perhaps she lived with/near a married Leist sister or a Sands relative between 1936-1948.

cheers
crankypants
 

DaveHam9

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#11
Hello crankypants,

Thank you very much. There are not many David SANDS who could have married Annie but we don't yet have something that ties them together. Yes, why Marrickville?? I will see if my database has any SANDS in that area.

Regards,

Dave

PS - Apart from a marriage - oh - it looks as though I'll have to get a copy
 
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DaveHam9

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#12
Hello crankypants,

Four relatives of David died in the Marrickville area - a nephew in Newtown in 1931, a married niece in Newtown in 1915, a married niece in Newtown in 1938 and a married niece in Marrickville in 1940.

Elizabeth, the spouse of said nephew James Swan SANDS died in Marrickville on 18 Feb 1948.

Australian Electoral Rolls, 1901-1936
Name: James Swan Sands
Electoral Year: 1930
State: New South Wales
District: Lang
Subdistrict: Petersham West
Elizabeth Sands, 44 Constituation road, Home duties
James Swan Sands, 44 Constituation road, Grocer
Kathleen Beatrice Sands, 44 Constituation road, Typiste

That's a daughter with them. James died in 1931 and I don't have spouse Elizabeth or any of the children in 1936.

ROOKWOOD CEMETERY
NAME: James S. Sands
AGE: 62
DEATH DATE: 8th August 1931
DENOMINATION: Presbyterian
DETAILS: Section: 5E, Row: 4, Grave: 313
INSCRIPTION: Husband and our Father

ROOKWOOD CEMETERY
NAME: Elizabeth Sands
AGE: 73
DEATH DATE: 18th February 1948
DENOMINATION: Presbyterian
DETAILS: Section: 5E, Row: 4, Grave: 313
INSCRIPTION: Wife of above

I have some loose ends with the SANDS family such as a few missing Electoral Roll entries and a few missing burials.

Regards,

Dave
 

crankypants

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#13
Hi Dave

Yes I think you'll have to get their marriage certificate to confirm if you have the right people. I'll eat my hat if it wasn't them:2fun: I'll be doing a lot of choking if I'm wrong.

Let me know the other SANDS that your missing for Electoral Rolls, etc.

cheers
crankypants
 

DaveHam9

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#14
Hello crankypants,

I hope it's a small straw hat. :D

Please see if you can find spouse Elizabeth in 1936. Kathleen married John PRICE in Ashfield in 1932. Elizabeth may be living with them or with other married daughters or with her unmarried daughter Heather. But Heather won't be on the roll because she was born in 1916.

Regards,

Dave
 

crankypants

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#15
Hello crankypants,

I hope it's a small straw hat. :D

Please see if you can find spouse Elizabeth in 1936. Kathleen married John PRICE in Ashfield in 1932. Elizabeth may be living with them or with other married daughters or with her unmarried daughter Heather. But Heather won't be on the roll because she was born in 1916.

Regards,

Dave
Hi Dave

1936 N.S.W Electoral Roll – Martin - Abbotsford
PRICE John Dembry 21 Lea avenue Five Dock clerk
PRICE Katherine Beatrice 21 Lea avenue Five Dock home duties

1936 N.S.W Electoral Roll – Parkes – Marrickville West
SANDS Elizabeth 36 Constitution road home duties
SANDS Florence Jean 36 Constitution rd salesgirl

cheers
crankypants
 

DaveHam9

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#16
Hello crankypants,

Thank you very much. So that explains Elizabeth's death in Marrickville. Actually I was a year out. Florence married in 1937.

Another daughter Marjory Alice b. 1909 married Reginald R McDONALD in 1935 in Petersham. They were living in Epping in 1944. I don't know where they were in 1936. Please see if you can find them. I have his service record and their deaths in Epping from Ryerson.

Thanks.

Dave
 

crankypants

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#17
Hello crankypants,

Thank you very much. So that explains Elizabeth's death in Marrickville. Actually I was a year out. Florence married in 1937.

Another daughter Marjory Alice b. 1909 married Reginald R McDONALD in 1935 in Petersham. They were living in Epping in 1944. I don't know where they were in 1936. Please see if you can find them. I have his service record and their deaths in Epping from Ryerson.

Thanks.

Dave
Hi Dave

1936 N.S.W Electoral Roll - Parkes - Ashbury
McDONALD Marjory Alice 7 Watkin street South Ashfield home duties
McDONALD Reginald Randolph 7 Watkin street South Ashfield salesman

cheers
crankypants
 

DaveHam9

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#18
Hello crankypants,

Thank you very much.

Let's work on James Swan SANDS. He was born in Glebe in 1869. I have nothing on him until he enlisted in the Boer War.

R/N 373 Private NSW Imperial Bushmen - 'F' Coy Lance Corporal 22 Apr 1901 - Queen's South Africa Medal & 5 clasps.

Then he married Elizabeth in Bathurst in 1903. I have him in the 1903 Electoral Roll in Bathurst.

Please see if you can find anything on him between 1869 and 1901.

Thanks.

Dave
 

crankypants

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#19
Hello crankypants,

Thank you very much.

Let's work on James Swan SANDS. He was born in Glebe in 1869. I have nothing on him until he enlisted in the Boer War.

R/N 373 Private NSW Imperial Bushmen - 'F' Coy Lance Corporal 22 Apr 1901 - Queen's South Africa Medal & 5 clasps.

Then he married Elizabeth in Bathurst in 1903. I have him in the 1903 Electoral Roll in Bathurst.

Please see if you can find anything on him between 1869 and 1901.

Thanks.

Dave
Hi Dave

These are the only James SANDS listed, 1892,1893,1894 are the only ones listed with a occupation of grocer.

1892 1893 1894 N.S.W Sands Directory
SANDS James, grocer, 59 Denham st, Glebe


1889
SANDS James Alice st, Auburn
SANDS James 25 Broughton st, Glebe
SANDS James 495 Riley st
1890
SANDS James 495 Riley st
1891
SANDS James 495 Riley st
SANDS James 50 Denham st, Glebe
1895
SANDS James 6 Gottenham st, Glebe
SANDS James 31 Comber st, Paddington
1896
SANDS James 8 Gottenham st, Glebe
SANDS James 31 Comber st, Paddington
1898
SANDS James Alexander st, North Sydney
SANDS James 3 Little Comber st, Pad’ton
1899
SANDS James Alexander st, North Sydney
SANDS James 3 Little Comber st, Pad’ton
1900
SANDS James Alexander st, North Sydney
SANDS James 3 Little Comber st, Pad’ton

cheers
crankypants
 

DaveHam9

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#20
Hello crankypants,

Thank you very much.

I have only 11 James SANDS in my tree :biggrin:

I can explain the Alice St one - an uncle of James Swan SANDS:

Death #8217/1889 SANDS JAMES WILLIAM CATHERINE CENTRAL CUMBERLAND
Died in Alice St, Auburn of burns suffered in his bakery shop at 190 Sussex St Sydney. Buried in Old Balmain Cemetery.


James, the baker had a son James born 1874 in Washington St Sydney. He married the daughter of a scale maker (yes WEDDERBURN) and his father-in-law taught him the trade. In 1903 he is in the Electoral Roll in Leichhardt.

M Sands James NSW 89 Styles Street Leichhardt 5150 Dalley Leichhardt Scale Maker

Please see if we can find a connection by looking for a scale maker, Robert WEDDERBURN. Thanks.

The Paddington and North Sydney ones are a mystery at the moment.

Regards,

Dave
 

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