Gaining citizenship of another country.

[benny1982]

Some people think citizenship of a country you move to and get citizenship means you are say American or Australian. To me that is not true. I dont think citizenship is a change of nationality. It just names you at most an "adopted American" or Australian say. Your true nationality is where you were born.

My 3xgreat aunty emigrated to America in 1880 and one of her sons was 5. He lived all his life in America and was a citizen but at most he was just an adopted American as he was technically English. He was not officially American.

My 3xgreat grandad emigrated to America and was an American resident. I dont know if he ever gained citizenship as he was 72 in the 1900 census and not a citizen.

What are your views?

 

[p.risboy]

I agree Ben. Where you are born is what you are.

No different as to what County your are born in either. If you were born in Bucks, and lived the rest of your life in Cumbria, you are still Bucks born.

The children of these 'citizens', are often called 'Canadian English' or American English'. Not sure what the term will be in Australia though.


Steve.

 

[benny1982]

My great, great gran was born in Sussex but grew up in London from babyhood. She was still Sussex born. But a Londoner by residence and upbringing.

I think where you are born instantly determines your nationality. So if you moved to America as a youngster from say Australia, you are still Australian no matter what. At most perhaps an adopted American but never, ever a true American. As you say someone born in America to foreign parents is called an Irish or Canadian American. I think most proper Americans will say you have to be born there to be a true American and I totally agree. Anthony Hopkins gained American citizenship in 2000 aged 62 but is no more American than I am and I am English through and through. He is just a citizen of America, not an American.

 

[benny1982]

As said you have to be born in America or Australia to be considered from that country. If not born in America but grew up then sorry, not American I am afraid.

I have a French ancestor who came to the UK in 1752. I dont think he was naturalised but if he was he was a citizen of England but still French.

 

[woodlander]

I think applying for citizenship is often done for a convenience thing - dual passports, residency laws etc rather than a declaration of personal preference

 

[gaelwyn]

As an Aussie, butting in on your chat, I agree about the difference in nationality and citizenship

Birthplace decides nationality :biggrin::biggrin:

We Australians will never add 'English' to our nationality such as the Americans do in 'Canadian American' etc.

The English who emigrate here and take citizenship are still called 'Poms'
Americans are still 'Yanks' or 'Septic tanks', depending on upbringing :2fun::2fun:

We are Australians....nothing more, nothing less

 

[leefer]

I beg to differ in a few cases my good people.

Donnami my wife was born in Australia and lived there untill she was nearly five,she remembers very little and though is proud of her dual citizenship even today really considers herself a British Citizen...her words not mine,so really there are two sides of the argument.
Many thousands of the young children in the years of travel to Aussie,Canada,New Zealand and the USA were all citizens of the UK....but i should imagine they didn't feel it after a few years in there adoptive countries.
A lot of course will depend on the age....being something dosn't always means you feel it.:biggrin:
So Benny where you are born not always determine what you feel though the records and facts dictate what you are.
Good points you make though and an interesting topic of debate.

 

[gaelwyn]

I see your point, Lee, and agree about the transplanting of children throughout the years.

What I gather from the conversation is that when people take citizenship of their chosen country, they are still not considered American, English, French or Australian because of a birthplace.

Your Donnami would obviously consider herself English, from her upbringing, to her accent. Quite often a persons accent will distinguish them from the natives!

 

[p.risboy]

As an Englishman, living in Ireland, I get called a Brit. I am not a Brit, I am English.
Ask a Welshman or a Scotsman, if they are British. I know what the answer will be.
It also annoys me in Passport applications, when they ask your nationality.

The only choice you get is British.. Or is it United Kingdom.

Don't get me wrong, I have no axe to grind with any nationality, but in this age of 'political correctness', it's about time it all caught up.

I'm English, and never British, no matter how 'they' wrap it.:biggrin:

Oh yes.....in 2 years time, I can apply for an Irish passport, and citizenship.:2fun:

I live the life of the Irish, and god bless 'em. :kissu:


Steve.

 

[benny1982]

Being a citizen of a country you emigrate to is completely different to being from that country. I always thought it is where you were born is what country you are from. I dont see how someone born in say Ireland but grew up in America could be a genuine American. An adopted American yes but not a genuine American. They never will be a genuine American because they were not born there.

However as Woodlander said obtaining citizenship is often for convenience and for benefit rather than wanting to become American or Australian etc.