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Harold Holmes b. Bradford Yorkshire abt 1877

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#1
This fellow turns up first on the England Census 1911 with his wife and 3 children. His child Ivy Isabella Holmes ( b. 21 MAR 1906 • Gillingham, Reg. Medway, Kent, England; V2a p772; mother Clarke; d. MAY 1992 • Canterbury, Kent, England; V16 p420 aged 85 years as Mrs LeGrove) is the mother of my 93-year-old mother in law who does not know her biological father.

Harold has become very mysterious, since we have eliminated most of the Harold or Harry Holmes born in or near Bradford within 2 years of 1877 without finding a family for him. Surnames we have tried for his mother and rejected are: Wrighton, Foster, Watson, Simpson, Sunderland, Wilkinson, Ingham and Midgley. On his documents for 29 Sep 1901 at St. Paul's, Chatham, Kent, England to Sarah Ann Clark, it states his father is John Holmes. Since we are unsure when he died or exactly where we cannot work out his mother's maiden name. His wife died as Sarah Ann Holmes in 1945 in Bradford. Incidentally, Harold Holmes came down South from Yorkshire to the Chatham Naval Dockyards where he worked as an Engine artificer for the Royal Navy, but was not a member of the Navy.

Where is his family of origin?
 

solidrock2

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#3

solidrock2

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#8
"Ivy Isabella Holmes ( b. 21 MAR 1906 • Gillingham, Reg. Medway, Kent, England; V2a p772; mother Clarke; d. MAY 1992 • Canterbury, Kent, England; V16 p420 aged 85 years as Mrs LeGrove) is the mother of my 93-year-old mother in law who does not know her biological father."

Marriage Registration 1931 Medway, Kent
Ivy I Holmes
Reginald A Le Grove

There is a previous marriage that maybe her..
Marriages Jun 1926
Holmes Ivy I Newman Greenwich 1d1808
Newman Dudley F Holmes Greenwich 1d1808




I can't find a birth for your mother in law, if she is 93 then dob around 1928
 
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solidrock2

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#12
Maybe Dudley and Ivy divorced as he marries again in 1958...

Marriages Mar 1958
NEWMAN Dudley F PRITCHARD Eastbourne 5h433
PRITCHARD Heather L NEWMAN Eastbourne 5h433


NEWMAN, DUDLEY FREDERICK 1896 GRO Reference: DOR Q2/1986 in EASTBOURNE (4541B) Volume 18 Page 536
 

ptjw7

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#13
I think the Newman marriage is wrong.
On the 1939 register there is a Dudley F Newman b 18 May 1896
and Ivy I Newman b 4 Aug 1905 living in Woolwich.
A Ivy Irene Holmes was born Sep q 1905 in Greenwich.
 

solidrock2

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#14
I think the Newman marriage is wrong.
On the 1939 register there is a Dudley F Newman b 18 May 1896
and Ivy I Newman b 4 Aug 1905 living in Woolwich.
A Ivy Irene Holmes was born Sep q 1905 in Greenwich.
Looks like that rules out mother in law being a Newman then. If she was born around 1928 she could of been an illegitimate child of Ivy Isabella who did'nt marry Reginald A Le Grove until 1931. There is only one female Holmes mmn Holmes born in 1928 in Woolwich.
 

spotrick

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#16
I would agree with ptjw7, seems the best fit.
HOLMES, HAROLD SUNDERLAND GRO Reference: 1877 S Quarter in BRADFORD YORKSHIRE Volume 09B Page 236
Yes, that looked promising, except .. that Harold may be listed in the 1911 census (as Harry) with his parents (at 30 Cobden St, Allerton) while our Harold is in the 1911 census in Gillingham.

By the way, Murfwalk's mother in law is my mother, born Margaret Holmes 1928. Harold is quite the mystery man.
 

ptjw7

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#17
He won't be the last to be on census twice!

Spotrick - do you have your mothers birth certificate, if so where was she born!
There is a Margaret Holmes born Bradford in 1928
 
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spotrick

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#18
SOLVED!

Turns out Harold was the son of John Holmes and Elizabeth Sunderland, as initially suggested. Confusion was caused by his brother Charles HENRY Holmes being listed in 1911 census as HARRY.

Harold Holmes joined the navy in 1900, and worked as an engineer in Chatham on various ships until his death in 1922.

Thank you all for your help. :)
 

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