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Harriet OLIVER

Bootzy

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#21
on Caroline Freeman to Oz..
NSW Deposit journal 1863
Charles Goldsmith paid Deposit 20 Jan 1863 for Walter Goldsmith age 15 Lab from Ramsgate, Sarah Goldsmith 16 ½ servant from Kent and a Caroline Freeman age 46 also servant from Ramsgate Kent C of E UK – “Spitfire” arrived 24 Aug 1863 (Tree has Walter & Sarah were Charles’s siblings and Caroline was his Aunt)

Caroline Frances Freeman m John Nicholls 1870 NSW.
Sydney Mail Sat 7 Jan 1871 – Marriages
NICHOLLS—FREEMAN—December 28, at the Scots Church, by the Rev. Dr. Lang, Mr. John Nicholls, carpenter and joiner, late of Blaney, a native of Shropshire, England, to Carolina Frances Freeman, of Pyrmont, a native of Ramsgate, England.

John Nicholls died 17 Jan 1884 Late of Blayney – Will NSW Gov Gazette Friday 1 Feb 1884 page 858 leaving effects to Caroline Frances Nicholls of Blayney.
NSW Gov Gazette Fri 9 July 1886 Will of Caroline Frances Nicholls late of Alexandria nr Sydney died 10 July 1885 last leaving estate to Ann Maria Price widow of Alexandria nr Sydney.

NICHOLS CAROLINE F 5801/1886 AGE 70 YEARS DIED WATERLOO – WATERLOO (one L)

Aust Town & Country Sat 19 June 1886
NICHOLLS.-June 10, at her residence, Gerard-street, Alexandria, Sydney, Caroline Nicholls, aged 70 years, relict of the late John Nicholls, Blayney, Her end was peace. Inserted by Mrs.Price.

way I see it is look at Charles Goldsmith deposit payer who is nephew to Caroline - ie marriage for a Freeman to Goldsmith around ramsgate area

Caroline b 1816 St Lawrence Ramsgate Kent to James Freeman & Elizabeth Williams

also found a Maria Freeman baptised 15 Feb 1807 Ramsgate Kent to James Freeman & Elizabeth William = Caroline’s sister - who married a Charles Goldsmith 31 Jan 1826 St Lawrence Thanet Kent - Maria dies June 1855 and Hubby Charles died 1849. Maria & Charles had 11 children.. son Charles b 1826 departs London 13 Nov 1852 arriving Port Jackson 28 Feb 1853 on ship “Hoogley”.
He married 13 April 1857 Sydney to Ann Maria Lawrence and died 1867 Sunny Corner Marrickville age 42 – Coroner’s report 7 Sept 1867

SMH Tue 10 Sept 1867 – DEATHS
On Thursday, 5th instant, at Petersham, Mr. CHARLES JAMES GOLDSMITH, grocer, late of Pyrmont, aged 42 years.
 

Bootzy

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#22
thanks Geoff re death for Pasher..

1851 census for Goldsmith’s
Maria Goldsmith head 42 widow b Ramsgate Kent – can’t read her trade
Charles J son 24 b same Grocer shopman
William son 20 b same bookbinder
Elizabeth daug 15 b same drapers assistant
James son 13 b same errand boy
Caroline daug b same scholar
Sarah Ellen daug 5 b same arrive Oz 1863 – m Henry Hall 1865 – remarried 1871 William Charles Crump & died 1924 Mosman NSW
Walter Joseph son 1 b same arrive Oz 1863 - cant see death for him..
 

Bootzy

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#25
Sarah Crump nee Goldsmith wasn’t a woman to mess with .. poor little nipper…

http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/177606373?searchTerm=sarah crump&searchLimits=

SMH Tue 13 May 1924
CRUMP. -May 12 11)21, at her residence, 60 Muston street, Mosman, Sarah Ellen Crump, in her 78th year
CRUMP. -May 12, 1021, at her residence, 60 Muston street. Mosman, Sarah Ellen Crump beloved mother of Mrs. D B Lawrence of Lindfield MrS A C Gain of Mosman, and aunt of M Goldsmith, in her 78th year

Death of Sarah Ellen’s husband.. - The Sun Wed 29 July 1925
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/223740511?searchTerm=william charles crump&searchLimits=

William Charles Crump, widower, of Beecroft, died, aged 81, on June 18
last, and his estate has now for probate purposes been sworn at £21,430. He left £1000 each to his grandchildren George Charles Rowe and Ruth Winifred Rowe, children of his deceased daughter Esther Rowe, on their attaining the age of 21. The residue of the estate was divided equally amongst the testator's daughters! Ruth Lawrence and Alice May Gain.
 
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Bootzy

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#28
it's only info on the siblings of Charles Goldsmith who was your Caroline Freeman's nephew.. her sister Maria married Charles Goldsmith and their son Charles came out to Oz and paid the deposits for Walter, Sarah & Caroline... see #21
 

DaveHam9

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#29
Possible..

Marriages Q2 1842
FREEMAN Caroline
GAIN William
GUTSELL Sarah
PIPER Cornelius
Rye 7, 569
How do we know what Caroline that is?

How do we know that Caroline and sister Maria are daughters of Richard Freeman & Maria Bates?
 

DaveHam9

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#30
Caroline b 1816 St Lawrence Ramsgate Kent to James Freeman & Elizabeth Williams

Then where is the connection to my tree?


I'm interested if we are following the right Caroline Freeman with marriage to Cornelius Piper.

Also any other children of Richard & Maria if any can be found.
 
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Bootzy

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#31
Dave, the Cornelius & Caroline ones dont think they are yours unless you can find marriage info on this...

Caroline Frances Freeman m John Nicholls 1870 NSW.
Sydney Mail Sat 7 Jan 1871 – Marriages
NICHOLLS—FREEMAN—December 28, at the Scots Church, by the Rev. Dr. Lang, Mr. John Nicholls, carpenter and joiner, late of Blaney, a native of Shropshire, England, to Carolina Frances Freeman, of Pyrmont, a native of Ramsgate, England. - was she a spinster or widow...

NSW Deposit journal 1863
Charles Goldsmith paid Deposit 20 Jan 1863 for Walter Goldsmith age 15 Lab from Ramsgate, Sarah Goldsmith 16 ½ servant from Kent and a Caroline Freeman age 46 also servant from Ramsgate Kent C of E UK – “Spitfire” arrived 24 Aug 1863 (Tree has Walter & Sarah were Charles’s siblings and Caroline was his Aunt) - her sister maria married a Charles Goldsmith...
 

DaveHam9

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#32
That one Val is on film at the Mitchell Library.

Film 0135
SYDNEY & ELSEWHERE
REVD. DR. JOHN DUNMORE LANG
19
Marriages 2 February 1869 – 6 May 1871 753-802
Marriages 12 June 1871 – 12 April 1873 803-848
Also: Revds. Alexander Waters Sinclair; Thomas Craig; J M Gray

Dave
 

DaveHam9

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#33
1851
Civil Parish: Udimore
County: Sussex
RD: Romney Marsh
Sub-RD: New Romney
ED: 4a; Piece: 1634; Folio: 573; Page: 15
Cornelius Piper 62 [b. Brede. Ag lab]
Caroline Piper 41 [b. Berkley] sic

Another one of the crazy ones.

Romney is in Kent.

The parish of Udimore is in Rye RD in Sussex.

Are we sure it's the right Caroline?
 

Bootzy

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#34
Parents’ Marriage
Name James Freeman
Gender Male
Marriage Date 31 Mar 1804
Marriage Place Parish of Ash, Canterbury Diocese, Kent, England
Spouse Elizabeth Williams
FHL Film Number 1736522

Name: Caroline-Frances Freeman
Gender: Female
Baptism Date: 7 Jul 1816
Baptism Place: St. Lawrence, Kent, England
Father: James Freeman
Mother: Elizabeth
FHL Film Number: 1850280
Reference ID: Item2 pg90 ln714

Name Maria Freeman – married Charles Goldsmith 1826 St Lawrence Kent – died 1855 Ramsgate
Gender Female
Baptism Date 15 Feb 1807
Baptism Place St. Lawrence, Thanet, Kent, England
Father James Freeman
Mother Elizabeth
FHL Film Number 1737004
Reference ID it 2

Name Elizabeth Freeman – married James Pullen 1833 Ramsgate Kent – died 1836 Ramsgate
Gender Female
Baptism Date 09 Sep 1810
Baptism Place St. Lawrence, Thanet, Kent, England
Father James Freeman
Mother Elizabeth
FHL Film Number 1737004
Reference ID it 2
 

DaveHam9

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#35
1841
HO107 Piece/Book 1106/8 Folio 16 Page 4
Registration District Rye
Parish Udimore
County Sussex
Address: Spring House
Robt Whiteman M 40 Sussex
Harriet Whiteman F 13 Sussex
Edward Whiteman M 8 Sussex
Ann Whiteman F 1 Sussex
Caroline Freeman F 30 Sussex
William Freeman M 7 Sussex
 
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DaveHam9

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#36
Re the 1842 marriage there are three other Caroline Freemans born Sussex old enough to have married that year.


Marriages Dec 1848
FREEMAN Caroline Rye 7 759 * but is that her maiden name ? Her name in 1841 but no status
WHITEMAN Robert Rye 7 759 * a widower

Caroline b. abt 1811 Udimore from 1851 and 1861 census.

Beckley and Udimore both NW of Playden.

Caroline Piper b. Beckley and a Caroline Whiteman b. Udimore - both born abt 1811

Deaths Mar Qtr 1900
Whiteman Caroline 89 Rye 2b 3
 
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DaveHam9

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#38
Whiteman or Piper ??

There is a very large Whiteman tree with descendants of the Udimore lot in NZ. Can't see a connection to my Whiteman from same area.

They have Caroline but just the marriage. Nothing on her or her parents.
 

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