Help needed - I'm confused - Manley

[Hearnan]

Hi all,

Could anyone clarify the following confusing information I have for a gggg grandfather pls.

I've been researching my tree for quite a few years but I can't work out which is the correct information.

I have two baptism records for EDWARD MANLEY

1st one

Edward Manley born 6th December 1805, Mother: Hannah Manley, Father: Thomas Wheeler. Baptised 26th December 1805 at St James Westminster. Upon looking at the scanned print it say bbs of Hannah Manley and Thomas Wheeler.

2nd One

Edward Manley 6th November 1805. Mother: Hannah, Father: Edward Manley, Baptism: 17th September 1809 Saint Magdalene, Bermondsey

I have found as much as I can on Edward - his wife is Sarah Hitchcock (although I can't find her parents either) and I have all their children.

I can't get back any further on either of the fathers name, I don't know which one is correct.

Can anyone shed any light on this. Are they two different Edward Manley's.

Thank you so much for taking the time to read this.

Michelle

 

[Ladybird1300]

Hello Michelle

Welcome to the forum


Edward Manly
[Edward Manley]
Age: 45
Born abt 1806
Relation: Head
Spouse-Sarah Manly

Born - Bermondsey
Civil Parish-Bethnal Green
Eccl. parish-St Jude
County Middlesex

Sub-reg distr - Church
ED-02

House sched number. 77. Piece -1541. Folio - 39. Page Number - 17.
Household Members.

Edward Manly 45
Sarah Manly 48
Mary Ann Manly 20
Sarah Manly 18
Edward Manly 27
[17]
William Wanly 16
Henry Wanly 9
Elizabeth Wanly 8
James Wanly 6
John Wanly 5
Charles Wanly 4
Anna Wanly 2

I believe he was born in Bermondsey

Amanda

 

[Hearnan]

Hello,

Thank you for your reply.

Yes that is the Edward Manley I'm looking for.

I just cannot get back any further than the two christenings. That both seem to be him.

I have contacted people who's have the same branch of tree and they can't work it out either.

It's a mystery that I can't leave alone.

Thank you for taking the time to reply to me

Michelle

 

[Ladybird1300]

But it says in the 1851 census that he was born in Bermondsey as above

Amanda

 

[Hearnan]

Hi Amanda,

I think I've been confused by other peoples trees that have Edward Manley's father as Thomas Wheeler. All the census records for him say he was born in Southwark or Bermondsey (which is the I believe is the same region)
I suppose I'm trying to find something more concrete of his mother and father but I can't find anything on any genealogy site. I am a novice at this, I'm not sure what to do to research back any further or just accept this is it. Thanks for your help

Michelle

 

[juliejtp]

Hi Michelle,

Who are rhe witnesses to Edward and Sarah's marriage they maybe relatives.
Two Edward Manleys have you looked through the records for the Edward Manley christened at Westminster just to eliminate the other or visa versa.

 

[emeltee]

First of all take anything you find on other people's trees with huge pinch of salt. Never accept what is in a tree until you have checked it out and confirmed that the information is correct. There are lots of people who will copy info from another tree just because it seems to fit with what they want. You have no idea what kind of research others have done, nor how thorough they have been. Always do the research yourself then you can be certain that what is in your tree is what you have found.

On the subject of Edward Manley it is possible that the Edward baptised in Westminster as the base born son of Hannah Manley and Thomas Wheeler and the Edward baptised Bermondsey to Hannah and Edward Manley in 1809 are one and the same. Hannah could have had Edward out of wedlock, as they say, and then married Edward Manley who adopted the child as his own, hence the second baptism to make him legitimate, so to speak. To prove this you would first need to find a marriage between Hannah Manley and Edward Manley. I cannot find a marriage for an Edward Manley to anyone called Hannah within the time period of 1800 to 1809. This doesn't mean that a marriage doesn't exist, just that I can't find one. If you can find Hannah and Edward's marriage this may help towards proving whether or not the two Edwards are one and the same.

After 16 years of searching my family, one thing I have learned is that you do have to flexible in your thinking. For example don't put anything in your tree if you cannot prove that it is correct but on the other hand be prepared to go with the flow. If all the Censuses say that your Edward was born Bermondsey/Southwark then I would tend to go with the Bermondsey baptism and Hannah and Edward as the parents. Both baptisms have the mother as Hannah and, as she is the one who gives birth, you can be pretty sure the mother is who she says she is. How do you know that the father is who she says he is?

Emeltee

 

[DaveHam9]

There is one difference that needs looking at too - 6 Nov and 6 Dec 1805.

Dave

 

[Hearnan]

Hi all,

Thank you for your replies.

The witnesses at Sarah and Edwards Wedding is Mary Ann Hitchcock and Robert Reef or Reet. I have looked into this but can find nothing concrete yet. Looking at their children, their first child was called Sarah who died at 3, then they had George (George & Edward is a recurrent name all the way through the tree) Then they had Mary Ann, then Sarah again, then Edward, all the way through to another Hannah and so on.

I have been doing my tree on and off since 2006. I agree with not going off others trees and I have nothing in mine that hasn't been backed up. Where I can I order the certificates I do.

I've just had another look at the bishops transcript from the christening in 1805 (Thomas Wheeler as father) and it just says the born on 6th so maybe its been assumed that its the 6th of December as that's the month the christening took place.

I am looking into following other lines to see if I can find them somewhere to eliminate them if possible.

I think they are the same person but with nothing concrete will keep looking and as time goes hope that some information will come up.

Most of the men in the my Manley tree are hairdressers which helps. All the grandfathers are going back to Edward.

Thanks again everyone for your replies.

I will crack this.... one day.

Michelle

 

[DaveHam9]

If Hannah's maiden name was Manley then it's a huge coincidence she 'marries' an Edward Manley ??


Edward Wheeler
Christening Date 26 Dec 1805
Christening Place St. James', Westminster, Middlesex
Thomas Wheeler & Hannah Manley