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How to trace parents with no records

ral91

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#1
Hi,

I feel slightly guilty for relying heavily on your expertise, but this is more of an advice thread than a look up. So I've got a Charlotte Spencer born in abt 1811, and I've no idea where other than London. I've no records other than her marriage but that doesn't list parents. At this stage I just want to go a bit further back then put some more meat on the bones of Charlotte.

Anyone who helped me with this lady in another thread might remember that she's the one I think might have Huguenot ancestry, and I have been told - by the a member of staff at the LMA - that Spencer may be derived from de Spencer.

Anyway, what exactly can I do to trace her parents? I don't know of any siblings and it's too early for Census and official birth registrations.

Thanks for any help:)

Ryan
 

duckweed

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#2
I suppose I would do a sweep of baptismal records in Hugenot areas of London such as Spitalfields. Does she have an address on her marriage certificate? Occupation of bride and groom might be an indicator as to place of origin. Check census records not just for them but for neighbours. Surprising the number of people who have kin somewhere near. Look at the first names of the children as may give clue to parents first names.
 

ral91

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#3
Hi Duckweed,

mmm, the marriage entry is really no help at all. No occupation, no parents, no age, no address. Literally just their names and signatures. The odd thing is, they married on the opposite side of town compared to where they lived most of their time.

Charlotte dies in 1846, so there is only one census entry for her and where it says "whether born in same county" there is a little squiggle which is the same next to everyone's name on those two pages.

Nevertheless, I may have a name to go on. A witness appears to be Sue Spencer at the wedding, although obviously this could be a sister. I think it says Sue. This is on A*****ry, would you mind taking a look?
(Bottom entry on the left page)

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec/...q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgPLz0q3dpid&pid=10006084

Ryan:)
 
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#4
Hi Ryan
If you have her marriage, you could look up census returns after this using her married name, to get a birth place and a rough birthdate. The mge cert will give an address, and bearing in mind that quite often a marriage took place where the bride lived, this may help.
Census returns before the mge, may also give the parents names and where they were born
Once you have a rough idea of where and when she was born you can look up these two sites to see if shes there
http://www.familysearch.org/eng/search/frameset_search.asp?PAGE=igi/search_IGI.asp&clear_form=true

http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html#p=home

If you find her in the first site, ( there are two born in London) on the results page, you will see a number at the bottom left of the screen. click on this, on the reulting page, fill in the fathers christian name and the surname in the main box. This will give you all children born to a father with that name, in the district to which the number refers, (ie C723017 is Westminster). If need be you can fill in mothers name as well to narrow things down a bit, bearing in mind that the mothers name was not always given.
hope you can understand this and it helps..
dave
 

ral91

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#5
Hi Dave,

I think I understand:) but what exactly is a census return (must sound like a right idiot now! :rolleyes:)

Is it the same as just looking someone up in Census'?

If not, where do I find Census returns?

Ryan:)
 

ral91

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#6
Dave,

In regard to what you said about having a marriage where the bride was born: There is a Charlotte Spencer born Saint James, Westminster, which I assume, without having looked, is the St James, Picadilly, Westminster which is where the marriage took place. Rather oddly though, that would make the bride 14 years old!
 
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#7
Hi Ryan
I call the return that is made for each district, a census return. Couple all the returns together creates the census.

I made my post before I saw your reply to Duckweed, and I was looking for a birth about 1811 as you had indicated. There just happened to be one in Westminster. Since seeing that the mge took place in 1827, I would be looking more
for a birth around 1805
I think the legal age then was 12 or 13, so it may be that she married at young. AND bear in mind the Westminster entry was a christenning date of 1813, which could have been some years after the birth.

dave
 
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ral91

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#8
Hi Dave,

Well on the only Census return I have for Charlotte in 1841, she is 10 years younger than her husband, William, who indicates his age to be 40 being b in 1801. I think I'll have to order her death cert to clarify once and for all her actual age and thus birth year but for now I can make a somewhat educated guess at around the late 1800's and early 1810's. Very vague, I know.

But I know the marriage definitely took place at St James' Piccadilly, 27 Aug 1827. One wonders why so little little information is listed on the entry I can see.


Ryan.
 
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#9
Hi Ryan
And it's always where you need that bit more info that you find a cert like that..
It depended on the vicar of the parish just how much was recorded. Some give you parents, grandparents, addresses etc etc and others nothing at all. I have one like yours.. so annoying.
dave
 

ral91

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#11
Good idea, although I have a fair guess, considering that theory, that he would have been a Weaver of some kind. William Bridges was a Silk Weaver as was Charlotte and William's daughter and her husband and his family. This is where my potential Huguenot theory enters the fray! I'll look up Spencer and see what I find.:)
 

duckweed

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#12
Looking at apprentice records for London I can't find any weavers called Spencer, commonest jobs are butchers, fishmongers and Vintners and grocers but Spencer is quite a common name.
 

ral91

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#13
Yeah I had no luck looking either, although I haven't uses that source much before so still may be doing something wrong! :p

As I said, I think I'll have to order a death cert as that is the only one that will be available. Her death seemed to be a catastrophic catalyst to much misfortune in their family, poor souls! Unless there is any other way to perhaps hunt down a possible birth, baptism or just earlier records regarding her.
 

ral91

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#15
Well the witnesses are hard to make out but from what I think they are, I have found no-one with those names. I don't know any of Charlotte or William's siblings or parents so I wouldn't be able to confirm; but looking at the grandchildren of William and Charlotte, the naming pattern only seems to apply to one son. Other than that, nothing really. :(
 

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