Looking for John Jefferies

[JefferiesFamilyTree]

Hello community, i'm trying to find the parents of a John Jefferies however i'm unable to locate any information. John Jefferies was inconsistent with his age/DOB and birth location which makes it tricky to find the information. I have linked the censuses, marriage cert and death cert which makes things easier to understand. MY aim is to try and find Johns parents so i can continue going back with my research.

Possibly Born in Middlesex?
possibly a servant/Butler like his father or maybe a Gas fitter / lamplighter like recent generations?


John Jefferies Junior

1841 Census - MISSING
1851 Census - MISSING
1861 Census - https://i.gyazo.com/f3fd43f6bc5813e3...9ac4381e39.png
1871 Census - https://i.gyazo.com/e0b68bea43973876...15fd4e5360.png
1881 Census - https://i.gyazo.com/a188e887ea45160b...87a04c3f4f.png
1891 Census - https://i.gyazo.com/4eaa0a764a016ce0...a4a253edbd.png

He died in 1899 so that was the last of the census. I have his death certificate of John Jefferies: https://i.gyazo.com/thumb/1000/b5dcb...a5f482-jpg.jpg

From looking at the census we can see he never kept a consistent age or birth location so it was hard for me to search for a place for possible baptism to find his parents.

John married Louisa Chalkley in 1855 and according to John at that time his father (John Jefferies) was a Butler.
Certificate: https://i.gyazo.com/7a886941d8d17797...880a9672f4.png

 

[emeltee]

Whereabouts are we looking?

Emeltee

 

[Llewred]

Think it is probably this one

Name
John Jefferies
Spouse's Name
Louisa Chalkley
Event Date
28 May 1855
Event Place
Saint James,Paddington,London,England
Father's Name
John Jefferies
Spouse's Father's Name
William Chalkley

 

[p.risboy]

Just a little more info should be posted, as to any references(Census or otherwise), you have found, would help other members, not going over the same ground a you have Ryan.

Saying his y.o.b and p.o.b changes in the Census, with out any references is not very helpful for other researchers.

Steve.

 

[JefferiesFamilyTree]

Whereabouts are we looking?

Emeltee

Hello Emeltee, sorry there was lack of information.

John Jefferies Junior

1841 Census - MISSING
1851 Census - MISSING
1861 Census - https://i.gyazo.com/f3fd43f6bc5813e3e9077d9ac4381e39.png
1871 Census - https://i.gyazo.com/e0b68bea439738765dc89d15fd4e5360.png
1881 Census - https://i.gyazo.com/a188e887ea45160bac925787a04c3f4f.png
1891 Census - https://i.gyazo.com/4eaa0a764a016ce07e1096a4a253edbd.png

He died in 1899 so that was the last of the census. I have his death certificate of John Jefferies: https://i.gyazo.com/thumb/1000/b5dcb95d97b4e9ad251b3d63e6a5f482-jpg.jpg

From looking at the census we can see he never kept a consistent age or birth location so it was hard for me to search for a place for possible baptism to find his parents.

John married Louisa Chalkley in 1855 and according to John at that time his father (John Jefferies) was a Butler.
Certificate: https://i.gyazo.com/7a886941d8d177975e995b880a9672f4.png

 

[JefferiesFamilyTree]

Just a little more info should be posted, as to any references(Census or otherwise), you have found, would help other members, not going over the same ground a you have Ryan.

Saying his y.o.b and p.o.b changes in the Census, with out any references is not very helpful for other researchers.

Steve.

Hi Steve, appreciate the message, please take a look at the original post now as I've updated with information

 

[JefferiesFamilyTree]

Think it is probably this one

Name
John Jefferies
Spouse's Name
Louisa Chalkley
Event Date
28 May 1855
Event Place
Saint James,Paddington,London,England
Father's Name
John Jefferies
Spouse's Father's Name
William Chalkley

Hi Llewred, my apologies on not making it clear in the original post, i have now updated the post with what i'm looking for and what i have found already.

 

[p.risboy]

2 Census returns give p.o.b. as Henley on Thames, Oxfordshire.

Have you tried for a baptism there.?

There is this marriage in Henley,(from OxFHS - Marriage index - 1538 -1837).

John Jeffries to Mary Rolls - 18 Jan 1794.

His fathers occupation as a Butler, could take him out of England, possibly abroad.


Steve.

 

[p.risboy]

Or...........not far from Hanover Square.!!

Name: John Jefferys
Gender: Male
Baptism Date: 18 Jan 1814
Baptism Place: Saint Martin In The Fields,Westminster,London,England
Father: John Jefferys
Mother: Sarah
FHL Film Number: 561145, 561146, 561147, 933987

Plus...........!!

Name: John Frederick Jeferis
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 9 Oct 1819
Baptism Date: 5 Nov 1819
Baptism Place: Saint Mary-St Marylebone Road,St Marylebone,London,England
Father: John Jeferis
Mother: Elizabeth
FHL Film Number: 580908, 580909, 580910


Steve.

 

[emeltee]

Not an easy chap to find at all. Lots of possibilities in the 1841/1851 Cenuses but just not able to pin him down. The many variations of the spelling of the surname doesn't help.

I have found a possible set of parents with a birth in the British Lying In Hospital, Endell Street, Holborn

Hannah Jeffries admitted 30 September 1825, wife of John Miles Jeffries, gentleman's Servant of St Marylebone. October, child delivered, baptised at home.

Not the most helpful of entries as it doesn't give the *** or name of the child. Howevee I cannot find another Jefferies child with a father John who was a Butler/male servant.

Emeltee

 

[JefferiesFamilyTree]

Not an easy chap to find at all. Lots of possibilities in the 1841/1851 Cenuses but just not able to pin him down. The many variations of the spelling of the surname doesn't help.

I have found a possible set of parents with a birth in the British Lying In Hospital, Endell Street, Holborn

Hannah Jeffries admitted 30 September 1825, wife of John Miles Jeffries, gentleman's Servant of St Marylebone. October, child delivered, baptised at home.

Not the most helpful of entries as it doesn't give the *** or name of the child. Howevee I cannot find another Jefferies child with a father John who was a Butler/male servant.

Emeltee

Your 100% correct, i could not find any record to link him to his parents, a baptism would of helped but even if we found one, we woudn't know if it was the correct one due to his inconsistent age and birht place. Because of the inconsistency i've tried looking for deaths between 1819-1900. Even then i still cannot match him to his parents.. Something of interest that i've saved though. Check this out:

https://i.gyazo.com/22e92d7e0202d0e1784378e64c7b56c2.png

 

[JefferiesFamilyTree]

Or...........not far from Hanover Square.!!

Name: John Jefferys
Gender: Male
Baptism Date: 18 Jan 1814
Baptism Place: Saint Martin In The Fields,Westminster,London,England
Father: John Jefferys
Mother: Sarah
FHL Film Number: 561145, 561146, 561147, 933987

Plus...........!!

Name: John Frederick Jeferis
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 9 Oct 1819
Baptism Date: 5 Nov 1819
Baptism Place: Saint Mary-St Marylebone Road,St Marylebone,London,England
Father: John Jeferis
Mother: Elizabeth
FHL Film Number: 580908, 580909, 580910


Steve.

Wow Steve they are very promising, I do think i read through the records before but i couldn't find any links to John himself. I'm starting to think his mother possibly died shortly after having John and his died moved away to do his job as a Butler however he must of known his father if he knew he was a Butler in 1855. I did do a little more digging and found this record.

it's a census in 1861. https://i.gyazo.com/2a8ec06d5cd93412b87a60d369509585.png

Its quite far from Middlesex but as you've mentioned, being a Butler, he possibly traveled far from home.

 

[emeltee]

In the 1861 Census you give, that John Jeffries is an Apprentice Tailor which doesn't really fit with servant/lamplighter.

Also it is not unknown for illegitimate children to make up a father and an occupation for him at a marriage, if only to save face and not have to admit that Dad could have been anyone. I'm not saying that your chap was illegitimate but I do think it is a possibilty to bear in mind, particularly with the lack of an obvious baptism to prove otherwise.

Emeltee

 

[JefferiesFamilyTree]

In the 1861 Census you give, that John Jeffries is an Apprentice Tailor which doesn't really fit with servant/lamplighter.

Also it is not unknown for illegitimate children to make up a father and an occupation for him at a marriage, if only to save face and not have to admit that Dad could have been anyone. I'm not saying that your chap was illegitimate but I do think it is a possibilty to bear in mind, particularly with the lack of an obvious baptism to prove otherwise.

Emeltee

It does seem strange how there's no records linking, could he have been given away by his mother? maybe his father was away at the time and his mother died at birth.. i don't know. i'm so keen on trying to find the father if he's out there.

 

[emeltee]

Until you have a baptism with names of parents and a marriage to link those parents together you can never be sure that you have the right person as the father. The only person you can say is 100% correct is the mother as she was the one who gave birth. Even if a couple are married there is still the possibilty that the husband might not be the father.

If I were you I'd take notes of what has been found then put it all on the back burner for a while - who knows what information is going to come on line in the next 12 months. Otherwise you may become fixated with a brickwall and forget about all the other ancestors waiting to be found.

Emeltee

 

[Ladybird1300]

Is it possible he was born in another country??

Name: John William Jeffreys
Birth Date: 13 May 1823
Birth Place: Eland of Madagascar, London, England
Gender: Male
Father: John
Mother: Keturah

From Dr Williams' Library which is between Marylebone and St Pancras.

Amanda

 

[JefferiesFamilyTree]

Is it possible he was born in another country??

Name: John William Jeffreys
Birth Date: 13 May 1823
Birth Place: Eland of Madagascar, London, England
Gender: Male
Father: John
Mother: Keturah

From Dr Williams' Library which is between Marylebone and St Pancras.

Amanda

Hi Amanda, there is a chance of him being born in another country, i cannot seem to find a 1841 or 1851 census of him anywhere, in 1861 he is living with Louisa. Strange how there is no baptism and he doesn't exist for the first 2 census.

 

[JefferiesFamilyTree]

Until you have a baptism with names of parents and a marriage to link those parents together you can never be sure that you have the right person as the father. The only person you can say is 100% correct is the mother as she was the one who gave birth. Even if a couple are married there is still the possibilty that the husband might not be the father.

If I were you I'd take notes of what has been found then put it all on the back burner for a while - who knows what information is going to come on line in the next 12 months. Otherwise you may become fixated with a brickwall and forget about all the other ancestors waiting to be found.

Emeltee

I've just been looking through John's 1861 Census where he is living with his wife and his children. There is one entry that Ancestry doesn't write out. Ill attach it here. I just can't make out the "Condition" column. It looks like a W but that'll be wife but Louisa is his wife. Could it be a M?
The entry is a female who is 17 years older than John so there's a possibility that's his mother?

 

[DaveHam9]

The system does that at times.

A few more of the status column would help. My reaction so far is for 'W'.

Thanks,

Dave

 

[JefferiesFamilyTree]

The system does that at times.

A few more of the status column would help. My reaction so far is for 'W'.

Thanks,

Dave

Thanks for the message Dave. I've uploaded the while Census. What could the "W" possible stand for if he was already married and living with his wife ?

IMAGE REMOVED. Please look at the census image above.