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Margaret Heffernan 1822 married Wm Cavanagh in Sydney in 1842

barbarajoh

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#1
Trying to find this lady's parents. She figures in 2 separate trees which have a good DNA match with. An Anne Heffernan is my brick wall. Hoping this lady is her sister as all I have is Ireland as place of birth and father Michael for my Anne. Trees on A have differing information as to Mgt but agree to the marriage to Wm Cavanagh in 1842. Children to Mgt Heffernan and Wm Cavanagh or Kavanagh are John S 1842, William 1845, Michael 1847, Dennis 1849 and Margaret 1853. One tree says Mgt Heffernan died in 1854 at Braidwood, NSW and one that she died in 1882 there. One tree says she was born Tipperary and one says Bristol, Gloucestershire. Any help would be great.
Barbara
 

barbarajoh

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#4
Thanks Gibbo, can't think what CUP could mean. Interesting inquest, poor drunk lady! Not to be allowed burial in the Catholic burial ground because she didn't attend.
 

gibbo

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#5
Hope i have the right passenger list for Margaret, so will have to be checked to be sure.

Ship Larne 1841
HEFFERNAN edmund aged 29, Elizabeth 26, Edmund 3, Michael 9 months.

On the same ship there is also a Michael Hawthorne aged 28, Bridget 26, Adam 4

Same ship also another Hawthorne family, Alexander 26, Mary 25, Adam infant.

http://indexes.records.nsw.gov.au/e...4_4788/Larne_21 Oct 1841/4_478800304.jpg&No=3

Then this for Michael Hawthorne arrival card. Only checked him out due to be noted on Margaret's arrival card.
 

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barbarajoh

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#8
It is not helped by the fact that Heffernan seems to be a common name in Ireland. This is the closest I have come to a clue at least. Anne born 1814 Ireland, and married Richard Blackman around 1833, no marriage found but he was a soldier at some point as she was a soldier's widow in 1851. They settled in Bucks, England and had Julie 1833, my ancestor Solomon in 1840. Anne remarried after Richard died so her father was down as Michael Evans but think that was someone not hearing the name right. She was Heffernan, Effron, Effernan on her children's births.
 

barbarajoh

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#9
Oh, I wrote that just before your post came in! Wow, Michael and Julia!! That is all fitting Gibbo. Very exciting Edmund could be another sibling. Still not quite understanding the Margaret connection to Michael Hawthorne?
 

DaveHam9

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#10
Explanation Barbara.

I think C U P = Came Under Protection of ...

Single women often came under protection of an older male friend or relative to make sure they didn't enter into any employment agreement before arrival. If they did then the ship's captain lost the bounty on that person not being available for employment on arrival.
 

gibbo

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#11
Oh, I wrote that just before your post came in! Wow, Michael and Julia!! That is all fitting Gibbo. Very exciting Edmund could be another sibling. Still not quite understanding the Margaret connection to Michael Hawthorne?
Michael Hawthorne married a Bridget Heffernan so i feel that maybe Bridget and Margaret might be cousins. Bridget's parents were David Carey and Margaret Heffernan [re shipping record posted earlier] Margaret Heffernan/Hawthorne might be a sister to Michael Heffernan?? All heresay at the moment tho.

Bridget Hawthorne [nee Carey] parents were David Carey and Margaret Heffernan .
Edmund Heffernan parents were Michael Heffernan and Julia. [possibly Margaret Cavanagh nee Heffernan and Anne's parents as well]

Maybe Margaret Heffernan and Michael were brother and sister.
 
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barbarajoh

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#12
Thanks for explanation of CUP makes perfect sense. As you say it is all heresay but more promising than anything for a long long time. I always wondered about my gg grandfather having a name like Solomon as it doesn't come from the Blackman side. There is a marriage for a Solomon Heffernan in Clonmel, Tipperary in 1811 so it may be a family name from that side of the family.
Off to bed now. Thank you for all the help.
 

gibbo

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One tree says Mgt Heffernan died in 1854 at Braidwood, NSW and one that she died in 1882 there. One tree says she was born Tipperary and one says Bristol, Gloucestershire.
The Margaret who died in 1882 was married to a Peter and her parents were Christopher and Margaret. Think that one can be ruled out.
 

barbarajoh

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That is probably the Margaret born in Gloucestershire then and the two people have got a bit confused in these trees.
Now I need to find people who have a dna match to Bridget and Edmund and I may be a step closer. Thanks Gibbo. Something to work on there.
 

DaveHam9

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#15
The marriage is on two different sets of films but all libraries are currently closed. One set of films is of the parish register. The second set is the film of forms the church sent to the Registrar General. The two films don't always have exactly the same details.

This is the closest I have to the date for a marriage at St Mary's RC Sydney to give an idea of what might be in the register.

St Mary's Sydney
Page 13
No. 80
1833 October
14th I married Andrew Gandon per Crocodile & Sarah Flood per Maria Ann
in presence of Thomas Coleman, William Whelan, Catherine Whelan
J. McEncroe

[Rev. John McEncroe]
 
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barbarajoh

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So I may be lucky enough to get other Heffernan witnesses helping to confirm family. Can anything further be found on Edmund and his wife. I will search from this end of course, someone else may be searching this family and have had success.
 

gibbo

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So I may be lucky enough to get other Heffernan witnesses helping to confirm family. Can anything further be found on Edmund and his wife. I will search from this end of course, someone else may be searching this family and have had success.
I was having a look yesterday and couldnt find anything that would help. Such as finding a Edmund Heffernan but no age or anything to help confirm if it was your Edmund or not.

Number INX-40-46504
Title HEFFERNAN Edmund
Index NameCriminal Depositions (Deposition Books) Index 1849-1949
Name Edmund
Surname HEFFERNAN
Alleged Offence Stealing from the person
Committed for trial at Bathurst
Place of Committal Orange
Date of Committal 28 Mar 1861

Even the newspaper article gives no age or anything that can be of use.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/62401498
.
 

barbarajoh

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#18
Thanks for trying. Michael Hawthorne had a brother Alexander on the same ship. I found on Ancestry. Alexander Hawthorne and Mary Carroll (with their infant son Adam who the ship record said "then died") Alexander's father Adam Hawthorne and mother Judith Heffernan. Judith seems to be both Julia and Judith Heffernan as mother for Michael in different records.
I did find a marriage for Edmund Heffernan to Elizabeth Campbell in 1837 at Cashel and Emly, Tipperary, witnesses Peter Campbell and Mary Durick. So at least we have a possible place for the Heffernans to come from.
Wonder why the single women didn't have to say who their parents were. Enough for a man to be in charge of them?
There is an Honora Heffernan on the same ship and a John. John's parents were James and Mary Heffernan though.

I found a criminal article for Michael Hawthorne too in 1842 for larceny in Sydney but not sure if he is the same one either.
 

barbarajoh

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#19
Just discovered that putting Julia in a search box with variations brings up Judith in the Irish records. Found a Joseph born 1814 at Moyne, Cashel and Emly to Michael Heffernan and Judith Horan.

But then with such common names there could be any amount of Michaels and Judith/Julias
 

gibbo

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#20
Yep i knew about Alexander, posted him in #5 on here. They all seemed to have gone their own way once arriving here, i cant find much on them and noticed in the article on Margaret's death that no family members were mentioned besides her husband and kids. I also noticed that her death index does not state her parents which makes me think close family were not near by otherwise someone would have known their names. I have some spare time again today so will keep digging something will have to turn up sooner or later :)
 

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