massive brickwall

[popsit]

Hello,

I am hoping someone may be able to help re my brickwall. I have tried everything and saturated websites etc. I think I may have to think outside the square but first I will see what others say. Apologies if I am a bit longwinded.
I am looking for a birth for a Joseph KIRBY. I have everything else on him but cannot find a birth with parents. Joseph was born in 1791 so the 1841 census says in Norfolk England. He married Sarah HEADEN/IN in 1809 5th July in Walsoken Norfolk. He died in 1844 December and was buried 25th Nov. Mileham Norfolk. Joseph was a national school master. He had the following children from 1811 through to 1823. I did find two more that might be his in 1838 and 1840. In order from 1811:
Henry, John, William, Sarah, Elizabeth (all baptised 6th May 1827, Southey Norfolk). Not the last two who were Mary and William. I am now thinking was he really born in Norfolk, was he born in a workhouse, was his mother a solo parent. Is the answer staring me in the face and I cant see it lol
Thank you for any help.


popsit

 

[horse]

Hi

Just a thought, if this is the correct burial for Joseph, it would give a DoB of c1769, unless there is an error somewhere.

NBI
25 Nov 1844
Joseph KIRBY
Age 75
Mileham, St John the Baptist
Norfolk.

Geoff

 

[horse]

We know Joseph died 1841-1851 because in 1851 Sarah is with son, Henry [b. Lincolnshire. School teacher] and she says she is a widow.

Geoff

 

[gibbo]

He died in 1844 December and was buried 25th Nov.

Deaths Dec 1844 [Dec is Dec quarter meaning Oct, Nov or Dec]
KIRBY Joseph Mitford volume 13 page 157

 

[gibbo]

I did find two more that might be his in 1838 and 1840

William and Mary born in 1838 and 1840
1823 to 1838 is a really large gap so i think we can eliminate William and Mary.

 

[horse]

Deaths Dec 1844 [Dec is Dec quarter meaning Oct, Nov or Dec]
KIRBY Joseph Mitford volume 13 page 157

I assume that means d. Dec Q. burial is definitely Nov.

Geoff

 

[gibbo]

Name Joseph Kirby
Spouse's Name Sarah Headin
Event Date 05 Jul 1809
Event Place Walsoken, Norfolk, England

 

[horse]

Name Joseph Kirby
Spouse's Name Sarah Headin
Event Date 05 Jul 1809
Event Place Walsoken, Norfolk, England

Yep, I have the PR's for Walsoken and neither bap. are in

Geoff

 

[horse]

Interesting that they married in Norfolk 1809, then by 1811 they are in Licolnshire - birth of son, Henry.

May be Joseph was from Lincolnshire

Geoff

 

[gibbo]

I checked the newspapers just on the off chance there was a marriage or death notice but couldnt find neither.

 

[horse]

Indexes for Norfolk can be checked HERE

Geoff

 

[popsit]

Hi,

Thank you for all your answers. So the info I have for josephs death is from find my past which doesn't state his DOB. Can I now then horse go with the info he was 75 at his death making it 1769 and not 1791 that he was born. I did follow sarah through all the census's where she lived with Henry. She died aged 90 in 1874 in Downham.

In the 1841 census he says he is fifty years old and was born 1791 in Norfolk. Maybe the person who was registering him made an error when writing his date of birth down.
One last question horse, when you say "Yep I have the PR's for walsoken and neither bap are in, who are you talking about.
P.S. I do have a printout from ancestry under "city and county directories 1600s-1900s" This is under Academies and schools:
NATIONAL SCHOOL, NORTHWOLD.....Joseph Kirby, master (Mundford).
I will now go back and see what I can find with a Joseph being born 1769 and see what there is.
Once again thanks lots for your thoughts etc much appreciated.


Popsit

 

[horse]

If we take Joseph's death first...

I don't know when/where he was born, all I know is that the 1844 death is possibly the burial in Mileham. 2 reasons, he was there in 1841 and there doesn't appear to be another death that fits between 1841-1851. The age at death of 75y must therefore be open to question or his age in the 1841 is an error.

Re., Sarah.. in 1851/61 she says she was b. Norfolk [Walsoken] in 1871 she says Waterbeach, Cambridgeshire. If you look at the image [below] you can see it looks like Wisbeach [should be Wisbech]. So her PoB must be open to question. The only redeeming feature is that Wisbech and Walsoken are more or less on the Norfolk/Cambridgeshire border, so is consistant.

I don't dispute you have printouts of Joseph's teaching position, I only said that the baptisms of Joseph and Sarah aren't recorded in the indexes [PR's] of Walsoken according the 'Archdeacon's Transcripts for Walsoken from 1668 to 1812'.

Geoff

 

[horse]

Ooops! Here is the image..

 

[Ellie7]

It also comes under Wisbech, Cambridgeshire. I found my ancestor in the Phillimore records at Fring, but no details stated. He also moved to the Wisbech area. Try Phillimores marriage records.


Ellie

 

[Ellie7]

http://contueor.com/wisbech/indexes/


I left a message on this site years ago ,and I was emailed by a close relative to my Seaman ancesters.

Ellie

Edit--http://londonfhc.org/content/catalogue?c=10&p=England,England,Cambridge,Wisbeach&f=1

 

[Ellie7]

So far only found Kirby at Wisbech St.Mary,but not a Joseph there.

Ellie

Edit--•Church of England ◦Wisbech St. Mary: Records of baptisms 1557-1880, marriages 1557-1676, 1697-1960, burials 1557-1879 and banns 1754-1837 reside in the Wisbech Museum. Microfilm copies of baptisms 1557-1880, marraiges 1560-1676, 1697-1960, burials 1557-1879, banns 1754-1863, 1805-45 and an indexed transcript of marriages 1560-1813 reside in the Cambridgeshire Archives. The Bishop's Transcripts for the years 1600-40, 1661-1857 can be found in the Cambridge University Library.

edit-Walsoken, Norfolk [TF470100] is 3.3 miles ( 5.3 Km) ENE of Wisbech St Mary, Cambridgeshire [TF421081]. This is measured directly between the two points 'as the crow flies' ignoring any geographical features such as rivers or hills

 

[Ellie7]

Familysearch
Wisbeach-St. Mary, Cambridge, England - Church records
Title: Parish registers for Wisbeach-St. Mary, 1557-1877
Authors: Church of England. Parish Church of Wisbeach-St. Mary (Cambridgeshire)
Film Items: Microfilm 1040586 Item 1 Marriage banns, 1811-1863.
Microfilm 1040584 Items 11 - 12 Baptisms, 1557-1812; Marriages, 1557-1676, 1688-1812; Burials, 1557-1566, 1577-1685, 1697-1812.
Microfilm 1040585 1040585 Baptisms, 1813-1875; Baptisms (Guyhirn), 1832-1863, 1877; Marriages, 1754-1876; Marriage banns, 1754- 1811; Burials, 1813-1876


Ellie

 

[Ellie7]

Name:
Joseph Kirby
Gender:
Male
Marriage Date:
5 Jul 1809
Marriage Place:
Walsoken, Norfolk, England
Spouse:
Sarah Headin
FHL Film Number:
1526745

Does this film give any more details?
has to be born c1770-1788 or he was a minor when he married.

Ellie

 

[Ladybird1300]

Hi,

Don't know if it's any use, but I have Kirby's from Stretham Cambridgeshire. I have one Joseph b 1723. Sadly I haven't found any of his sons named Joseph, he mostly had daughters anyway.


Amanda