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Phoebe?????

romany rose

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#1
Hi looking for the following
John Gould born Brassington,Derbys and Phoebe is wife Pheobe in the 1861 census at Gorsey Bank nr Wirksworth Derbys
the census shows that Phoebe was born osmaston ,Derbys and that John is a stone mason
need to know
what year was phoebe born ?
what year did she marry John Gould ?
if Possible what year did John and Phoebe die?
was there any children?
many thanks
Romany Rose
 

juliejtp

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#2
Hi,

May be something or not. Cant seem to find either John Gould or Phoebe in 1851 or after 1871. There is a Phoebe Maskrey born Osmaston abt 1824 with husband John in 1851 and 1861. John and Phoebe Gould (transcribed as Gauld) in 1871 are living next door to John Maskrey born abt 1840 Gorsey Bank. From 1881 Phoebe Maskrey is a widow. A John Maskrey married in 1847 district Ashbourne brides listed are Phoebe Webberley and Elizabeth Warrington. Whether this is the same Phoebe, perhaps she and John Maskrey went their seperate ways and she took up with John Gould, though have'nt found anything to back it up. :)
 
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juliejtp

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#3
1861 has a John Maskrey lodger is classed as married living in the civil parish of Monks Coppenhall, Cheshire.
No sign of Phoebe. There is a death for a Phoebe Maskrey.

Do you have any other info on John and Phoebe Gould?
 
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#4
Hi Julie and RomanyRose

Some brilliant work again Julie. I do believe you've cracked it, but missed the clincher.

John is a Stone mason throughout born at Wirksworth, Pheobe was born Osmaston.
On 1881 and 1891 census Phoebe Maskrey is with married sister Rachel Hunt, born Longford
On 1861 census Pheobe Gould is with unmarried lodger Rachel Wibberley, born Longford, and child You found a marriage in 1847 of Pheobe Wibberley.
I haven't looked yet, but I bet there's a marriage of Rachel Wibberley to --?-- Hunt
So I believe we now have Pheobe from 1851 to 1891 but why the name Gould/Gauld in 1861/71 I don't know
dave
 
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#5
marriage
Registration district: Derby
Inferred County: Derbyshire
Volume Number: 7b

George Hunt Jul-Aug-Sep 1870 Derby Derbyshire
Louisa Miller Jul-Aug-Sep 1870 Derby Derbyshire
Charles Smith Jul-Aug-Sep 1870 Derby Derbyshire
Rachel Wibberley Jul-Aug-Sep 1870 Derby
 
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#6
1841 England Census

Civil parish: Longford
Hundred: Appletree
County/Island: Derbyshire
Country: England

Registration district: Ashbourne
Sub-registration district: Brailsford

Piece: 181 Book: 10 Folio: 20 Page Number: 14

Wm Wibberley 45
Phoebie Wibberley 45
John Wibberley 15
Mary Wibberley 13
Elizth Wibberley 9
Rachel Wibberley 5

dave
 

DaveHam9

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#7
Great work Julie & dave,

Looks as though John MASKREY's mother is a Mary/Maria GOULD. So was John illegit?

Seems not if he was born 1815 and parents married in 1811.
 

DaveHam9

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#8
I can't see an obvious death for either John or phoebe.

This is a possible:

County Derbyshire
Place Osmaston
Church St Martin
RegisterNumber
MarriageDate 08 Feb 1823
GroomForename Robert
GroomSurname WIBBERLEY
GroomAge
GroomParish
GroomCondition
GroomOccupation
GroomAbode Osmaston
BrideForename Hannah
BrideSurname WIBBERLEY
BrideAge
BrideParish Osmaston
BrideCondition
BrideOccupation
BrideAbode
GroomFatherForename
GroomFatherSurname
GroomFatherOccupation
BrideFatherForename
BrideFatherSurname
BrideFatherOccupation
WitnessOneForename Edward
WitnessOneSurname WIBBERLEY
WitnessTwoForename John
WitnessTwoSurname WIBBERLEY
Notes
FileNumber 20781
 

oznannie

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#9
Here's 1861 for our peeps
3 Payne St Derby
John 40 stonemason bn Wirksworth Dby, Phoebe 37.
Rachael Webberley lodging unm 25 born Longford, Staffs
son John H.B 2yrs bn Derby.
Oznannie
 
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#10
1841 England Census
about Phebe Webberley Name: Phebe Webberley
Age: 15
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1826
Gender: Female
Where born: Derbyshire, England

Civil parish: Ireton Kirk
Hundred: Wirksworth
County/Island: Derbyshire
Country: England

Street Address: Rectory House

Registration district: Ashborne
Sub-registration district: Brassington

Piece: 198 Book: 1 Folio: 8 Page Number: 9

John Cockayne 80
George Cockayne 25
Phebe Webberley 15 Serv
Elizabeth Cockayne 9
Mary Cockayne 30

Looks like Pheobe was a serv in 1841.
 
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#11
1841 England Census

Civil parish: Wirksworth
Hundred: Wirksworth
County/Island: Derbyshire
Country: England

Street Address: Gorsey Bank

Registration district: Belper
Sub-registration district: Wirksworth

Piece: 198 Book: 11 Folio: 50 Page Number: 15
Household Members: Name Age
Benjamin Maskrey 50 Stone Mason
Mary Maskrey 50
John Maskrey 25 Mason
Edward Maskrey 20 Mason
Elizabeth Maskrey 18
Ann Maskrey 15
James Maskrey 12
Eliza Maskrey 10
Anthony Maskrey 8
Sarah Maskrey 2
 

juliejtp

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#12
Hi,

Phoebe died in 1903 district Belpher.

Ph*be Maskrey born about 1824.

Thanks DaveL for finding Phoebe in 1861 started to think I was on the wrong track. Daveham finding Johns birth so he was born Gould. :)
 
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#13
This is John's parents as found by Daveham
England, Derbyshire, Church of England Parish Registers, 1538-1910

name: Benjamin Maskrey
event: Marriage
event date: 10 Jun 1811
event place: Wirksworth, Derbyshire, England
gender: Male
spouse: Mary Gould
digital folder number: 004451799

so John was born a Maskrey, married Pheobe Wibberley in 1847
1851 was still Maskrey
1861/71 Had now taken his mother's maiden name of Gould. WHY? Does not appear to be any children, but living with them in 1861 was her un-married sister Rachel Wibberley and her child John.
1881/91/1901 Pheobe (Widow) living with Widowed sister Rachel, reverted to surname of Maskrey (Masking - 1901)

This could be John's death

Name: John Maskrey
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1806
Date of registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1876
Age at Death: 70
Registration district: Derby
Inferred County: Derbyshire
Volume: 7b 276

this could be Pheobe's death

Name: Ph*be Maskrey
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1824
Date of registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1903
Age at Death: 79
Registration district: Derby
Inferred County: Derbyshire
Volume: 7b 345

1901 England Census

Civil parish: Derby
Ecclesiastical parish: St Anne
County/Island: Derbyshire
Country: England

Registration district: Derby

Piece: 3222 Folio: 161 Page Number: 30

Rachel Hunt 66 Longford
Phoebe Masking 77 Osmaston
Florence Wathington 12 G.dau Derby

dave
 

DaveHam9

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#15
Yes Julie. I thought at first John had been born before his parents married but then realised that was not the case if age in census is correct suggesting he was born in 1815. But I can't find a birth/baptism record.

Yes dave. WHY? I can't think of a reason.
 

DaveHam9

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#18
Thanks Julie. ;)

Now, I AM confused. :2fun:

I said there was no obvious death and therefore left it to others to suggest possibles.

Spouse is Harriet? And looks as though age at death could point to a birth before 1815 for both of them. So how do we sort the 2x John out? Did they swap spouses?


Can't find a marriage to a Harriet (variations).

2nd one has to be the widow:

Deaths Jun 1876
MASKREY Harriet 63 Derby 7b 281
Deaths Jun 1877
MASKREY Harriet 65 Derby 7b 281
 
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DaveHam9

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#20
I realise that Julie. I think you have the right death.

This one seems too young:

Deaths Dec 1874
Maskrey John 52 Belper 7b 397

If we rule out the one with spouse Harriet we are left with the John GOULD who could have been born before that 1811 marriage.
 

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