Robert Henry WALL

[DaveHam9]

Hello,

Enlisted 4 Jan 1916 - S/N 1757 54th Bn - 20 yrs Labourer - NOK father Wall George living at Bourke, NSW - Embarked Sydney HMAT A40 'Ceramic' 14 Apr 1916

So possibly born about 1896 Bourke.

Death 9390/1956 WALL ROBERT HENRY - GEORGE ALFRED - ELIZA JANE - CAMPSIE

A marriage that would fit except a tree has Eliza's name as ELBOURNE.

7051/1896 WALL GEORGE A - HOUGHTON ELIZA J - BOURKE

Siblings, including one born before the marriage, but no sign of a reg for Robert:

7236/1894 WALL GEORGE A - GEORGE A - ELIZA J - BOURKE
20025/1897 WALL RUBY M - GEORGE A - ELIZA J - BOURKE
28808/1899 WALL MARY J - GEORGE A - ELIZA J - BOURKE

A possible 1st for Eliza but the name is different. There are ELLBOURNs and ELBOURNEs in different parts of NSW.

Marriage 3879/1888 HOUGHTON ERNEST H - ELLBOURN ELIZA J - BATHURST

Where is the death for Ernest?

The tree has these as the deaths:

24017/1936 WALL GEORGE ALFRED - JOHN - MARY ANN - BOURKE
21420/1944 WALL ELIZA JANE - WILLIAM - ? - WAVERLEY

Marriage 896/1862 ELLBOURN WILLIAM - CONNOLLY MARY - SYDNEY

But the tree has Mary's name as McNAMARA and Eliza Jane's birth in 1871 Bathurst. I can't find a reg for Eliza 1860-1873.

Births
19065/1873 ELLBOURN LOUISA - WILLIAM - MARY - HILL END
10161/1880 ELLBOURN ANN ADELAIDE V - WILLIAM - MARY - BATHURST

Who else is lost?

 

[DaveHam9]

Divorce 1623 1894 HOUGHTON Ernest William - HOUGHTON Eliza

 

[horse]

In the short term, the facts appear to be basically all there, it is probably a question of reading between the lines, accepting divorce and reality.

Still looking BTW

 

[DaveHam9]

I can't find a Mary McNAMARA to CONNOLLY marriage.

If Eliza Jane was born in Bathurst the name would be ELLBOURN so why does the tree have ELBOURNE and McNAMARA? Bathurst and Bourke have no connection. They are hundreds of miles apart and very different sort of geography.

Too many missing reg. The gaps could be filled many ways.

 

[horse]

Eliza divorced 1894 and remarried 1896..

Australia Marriage Index, 1788-1950 about George A Wall
Name: George A Wall
Spouse Name: Eliza J Houghton
Marriage Date: 1896
Marriage Place: New South Wales
Registration Place: Bourke, New South Wales
Registration Year: 1896
Registration number: 7051

 

[DaveHam9]

George junior born 1894.

 

[horse]

Before or after divorce?

 

[DaveHam9]

Don't know yet Geoff.

This is getting very weird. The index ends at 1912:

Birth 30647/1934 WALL ROBERT H - GEORGE A - ELIZA J - BOURKE

He said he was 20 when he enlisted in 1916.

If you can check that one it should be Reg # 30647R

Whatever the R means it is an altered record.

30647/1934 HOUGHTON ROBERT H - - ELIZA J - BOURKE

Why was it not done in 1920 before he married?

2172/1920 WALL ROBERT H - POWELL ELSIE M - ROCKDALE

One possible answer - passport application in 1934.

 

[horse]

I don't fully understand that, sorry...

 

[DaveHam9]

3 way bet

30647/1934 ELBOURNE ROBERT H - - ELIZA J - BOURKE

 

[DaveHam9]

I don't fully understand that, sorry...

There is a 100 year embargo so births are available up to the end of 1912.

A birth registration has been changed in 1934:

30647/1934 ELBOURNE ROBERT H - - ELIZA J - BOURKE
30647/1934 HOUGHTON ROBERT H - - ELIZA J - BOURKE
30647/1934 WALL ROBERT H - GEORGE A - ELIZA J - BOURKE

Sorry, was on page 2:

30839/1895 HOUGHTON ROBERT M - - ELIZA J - BOURKE
30839/1895 ELBOURNE ROBERT H - - ELIZA J - BOURKE

 

[horse]

I didn't understand because none in those formats are on the index

 

[horse]

Ah! Just a mo... Just seen your edit..

 

[DaveHam9]

So the birth was registered under Eliza's married name with an error in Robert's initial. Registered under her maiden name then in 1934 changed to WALL way after Robert had married as WALL.

Next part to solve. Can a birth reg be found for Eliza?

 

[horse]

Australia Birth Index, 1788-1922
Name: Eliza Elbourn
Birth Date: 1862
Father's Name: Josephe Elbourn
Mother's name: Mma
Birth Place: New South Wales
Registration Year: 1862
Registration Place: Clarence Town, New South Wales
Registration number: 7013


There was also one in Victoria that looked good, lost it for the moment...

 

[DaveHam9]

Thanks Geoff.

That's where we start to have problems because Eliza it's claimed was born in 1871 in Bathurst. Married young then if that's correct.

I've not proved the 1944 death is the right one yet. No age at death yet or other details.

 

[horse]

Ok, Dave, I concede (for now) :2fun:

Need some sleep, cya later...

 

[horse]

Australia Birth Index, 1788-1922
Name: Eliza Elbourn
Birth Date: 1862
Father's Name: Josephe Elbourn
Mother's name: Mma
Birth Place: New South Wales
Registration Year: 1862
Registration Place: Clarence Town, New South Wales
Registration number: 7013


There was also one in Victoria that looked good, lost it for the moment...

If Eliza's father was William, the above can't be correct..

 

[horse]

Because she had been married at least twice, the informant may not have known her original maiden name, therefore her father, William is probably all that is known, factually..

 

[DaveHam9]

Ok, thanks Geoff.