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William and James Clark Salford 1800's

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#1
Hi all
I REALLY need your brains and expertise with this one!
I cannot find a birth for my G Grandad William Clark B 1873/74 in Salford (according to all his census records).
I have his marriage cert to Edith CROOK on 24/2/1892 at St Simons Church Salford. His age is given as 18, Edith's as 19. They both give address as 4 Back Davies St. I found a birth for her Salford Dec 1873. His father is James Clark a cotton spinner. The census reports were taken usually in April and on some census records they are the same age, which may mean he lied, or looking at the marriage cert,he had a birthday between 25th Feb and April when the census was taken. I searched FreeBMD, UKBMD, A...y and even googled him. My puzzle is that his grandad(?) was also called James Clark b1825. He had a son also called James b1849 which is more realistically William's dad but on 1881 census the James born 1849is not present and William is listed as his SON?On the original image scanned, there is a small smudge mark on the left of SON - possibly a g? He would have been 50 when William was born. I know this is possible, but his other children start with James in 1849 through to 1881 with a 7 year gap between child 3 and child 4. The youngest child on the census Mary, is a baby (perhaps William's sister?) and James b1825 occupation is 1861 skinner, 1871 carter, 1881 hawker? I cannot find him in 1891 and have trudged through heaps of censuses looking for a cotton spinner. This is driving me nuts so I thought if I get a birth cert for William's parents I can establish if the elder James is his grandad?
I have obtained:
grandad's birth cert -7/7/1904 (William Clark) Salford
nanna and grandad's marriage cert (William Clark and Doris Procter) 25/7/1931 at Sacred Trinity Salford
His parents - marriage cert - William ClarkE and Edith Crook 24/2/1892 at St Simons Salford. This is definately his parents although there is an E at the end of Clark. I cannot go any further because I am unsure if the vicar wrote an E in error or if they dropped the E with their children? Hence my problem - how do I know I have the correct lineage? mmmmmmmm
Mum and her siblings are spelt Clark There are so many Clark's and Clarke's in Manchester at the time I am searching for William senior's family - 1873-1901, I am going crazy. Maybe I am overlooking something simple here from brain drain??
cheers
Karen :(
 
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#4
Hi
You've a good one here... best of luck
A couple of things which may or may not help.
In 1891 the occupants of 4 Back Davies Street were Thomas Drinkwater 57 his wife Jane Emma 55 and daughter Hester 11 (on 1881 census she is called Henrietta aged 1
I presume you have at least the census returns for William (b 1874) for 1881/91/1901, James senior for 1861/71/81, and that James junior is only on the 1861 census aged 13.
There is a James Clarke aged 20 in 1871 (age rounded down) born Salford occupation Hawker who is a prison inmate If James junior did not marry, and was a bit of a lad, his son William could very well have been brought up by his grandfather as their own to prevent gossip etc
dave
 
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#5
Good morning all
Thanks for your replies, Dave this is what I have so far:

1861 census at 2 Back (?) Firebrick St St Stephens
James ClarkE 36 Skinner b Manchester
Sarah ClarkE 34 nothing listed b Salford
James ClarkE 13 (?)Rafier b Manchester
Alice ClarkE 5 b Manchester
Mary ClarkE 1 b Salford
There is a family above them called Kennedy that appears to have the same address.

1871 census at 2 Brown Place Salford:
James ClarkE 45 carter
Sarah ClarkE 44 nothing listed
Alice ClarkE 15 doffer
Mary ClarkE 11 scholar
Sarah ClarkE 8 scholar
Mary Hale 40, spinner and Sarah Hale 12 boarders also present


1881 census at 4 Coopers Court (Queen St)
James Clark aged 56 Hawker b Salford
Sarah Clark wife aged 54 Hawker b Salford
Sarah Clark daughter 19 Doffer b Salford
William Clark son 6 scholar b Salford
Mary Clark daughter "under 1 yr" b Salford
Joseph Gibson Boarder 19 - Striker of Bolts b Salford (witness or father of witness? to marriage of William 1874 and Edith Crook)

1891 census I cannot find any of them
1901 and 1911 returns I have my g grandad and children - I know these are correct for sure (mum's aunties)
cheers
Karen
 
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#6
Hi Karen
1891 census
Sarah Clarke 64 Salford, Hawker
William Clarke 16 son Salford, Gen Lab
Mary A Smith 39 boarder London, Paper bag maker
living 34 Caygill St, Salford

does the name Drinkwater mean anything to you?
dave
 
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#7
Hi Dave
I found this one too but Sarah is widowed and William is b 1875. He got married the following year and father is a cotton spinner - not listed as deceased on the certificate? Maybe you are right - James the prisoner is his dad but then who is his mum???? How did you find the prison record please?
I haven't come across Drinwater as yet - why is that?
cheers:biggrin:
 

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