William Burgess 1902

[Robster936]

I am trying to find information on my maternal grandfather. Information from an Auntie as follows:
Born 5th May 1902 in a Manchester workhouse was illegitimate. Died Manchester 1970
Mother was Elizabeth Burgess who never married born 1877 died 1949
Her parents were John Charles Burgess (worked on railways) and Elizabeth Ann nee Everett
Other known info on William:
Married Mabel Crowder 1929 in Barton, had several children and adopted two of her children from previous relationships
Traveled to France as some stage to work - don't know when
Was a lathe operator and also miller by trade worked for Metropolitan Vickers.
Had an elder brother Frederick who had a middle name Beatty I think.
Haven't found him in the 1911 Census with any certainty
Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[gibbo]

1939 register - I dont have access to get further info.

Burgess Household
Manchester C.B., Lancashire, England

FIRST NAME(S) LAST NAME(S) BIRTH YEAR
William Burgess 1902
Mabel Burgess and 3 more people are on this record
2 more people who are officially closed

 

[Robster936]

gibbo - thank you for that, i've signed up to findmypast but they want a full years subscription up fron t to gain access to the 1939 register. I have an idea who the other people in that register.
Ideally ni'd like to try and find his father but it does seem a mission impossible.
Cheers

 

[gibbo]

Hi Rob,

Do you have either birth certificate for William or Frederick? No mother's name mentioned on what appears to be their birth index from Gro.

BURGESS, FREDERICK BEATY -
GRO Reference: 1900 S Quarter in CHORLTON Volume 08C Page 783

BURGESS, WILLIAM -
GRO Reference: 1902 J Quarter in CHORLTON Volume 08C Page 736

Wonder where the name Beaty comes from

 

[gibbo]

The below info will have to be checked, im not very experienced with the Uk census.

1901 uk census
John C Burgess Head 53 Foulmire, Cambridgeshire
Elizabeth A Burgess Wife 52 Foulmire, Cambridgeshire
Elizabeth Burgess Daughter 23 Ardwick, Lancashire
Emily Burgess Daughter 15 W Gorton, Lancashire
Edith Burgess Daughter 13 W Gorton, Lancashire
Frederick B Burgess Grand Son 0 W Gorton, Lancashire
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
1911 uk census
Name William Burgess
Event Place Styal, Homes Handforth, Cheshire, England
County Cheshire
Parish Styal
Sub-District Wilmslow
Registration District Bucklow
Age 8
Occupation SCHOOL
Birth Year (Estimated) 1903
Birthplace Manchester, Lancashire
Relationship to Head of Household Inmate
Line 30
Page 16
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
1911 uk census
Name Freddy Burgess
Event Place South Manchester, Gorton, Lancashire, England
County Lancashire
Parish South Manchester
Sub-District Ardwick
Registration District Chorlton
Age 10
Birth Year (Estimated) 1901
Birthplace West Gorton, Lancashire
Elizabeth Burgess Head F 62 N K, Cambridgeshire
Lily Burgess Daughter F 33 Manchester, Lancashire
Emily Burgess Daughter F 25 West Gorton, Lancashire
Freddy Burgess Grandson M 10 West Gorton, Lancashire

 

[Robster936]

gibbo,
I've seen the census records and also the GRO references for the births. I think they are the two children since they have a blank for mother's maiden name. I have applied for his marriage certificate to Mable Crowder in 1929 hoping it may list his father but i suspect he may never have known his name. Next option after that is to apply for his birth certificate.
Not looking to promising.

 

[gibbo]

Not good chances of finding out who the father is if there is no paper trail. I have been wondering where the name Beaty come from. There are heaps of surnames in free bmd of Beaty, wonder if that could be a hint of Frederick's father maybe.

 

[trace]

Transcription for baptism of Frederick Beaty...
Longsight, St Clement
Manchester
20 July 1900
mother Elizabeth Burgess

Entry into Manchester Workhouse - Chorlton Union
Adm 14 April 1902 exit 14 June 02
Elizth age 25
Fredk B age 2

 

[Robster936]

trace, thank you for that, it's another piece of information.
I found a copy of the Register of Births for the Chorlton
Union Withington Workhouse which has William Burgess born 5th May.
This fits in with that particular stay at the workhouse.

The hunt goes on.

 

[horse]

Not good chances of finding out who the father is if there is no paper trail. I have been wondering where the name Beaty come from. There are heaps of surnames in free bmd of Beaty, wonder if that could be a hint of Frederick's father maybe.

Interesting, Gibbo... Just checked out the name Beaty in the area, possibly the closest..

1891
Parish: Gorton
Sub-RD: Ardwick
ED: 48; Piece: 3172; Folio: 96; Page: 36
Add: Robert St.

Included in the family are:
William R Beaty 18
Frederick Beaty 15

This is the reference for Elizabeth Burgess in 1891 = ED: 48; Piece: 3172; Folio: 89; Page: 22. Add: Ellen St. [Address look to be within 3 miles of each other]

Geoff

 

[gibbo]

Interesting, Gibbo... Just checked out the name Beaty in the area, possibly the closest..

1891
Parish: Gorton
Sub-RD: Ardwick
ED: 48; Piece: 3172; Folio: 96; Page: 36
Add: Robert St.

Included in the family are:
William R Beaty 18
Frederick Beaty 15

This is the reference for Elizabeth Burgess in 1891 = ED: 48; Piece: 3172; Folio: 89; Page: 22. Add: Ellen St. [Address look to be within 3 miles of each other]

Geoff

That is interesting Geoff. I wonder IF he is the father to Frederick if he could also be the father of William. All suggestive of course without anything to confirm any of it. I wonder if any further records from the workhouse have survived that give more details to help.

 

[horse]

That is interesting Geoff. I wonder IF he is the father to Frederick if he could also be the father of William. All suggestive of course without anything to confirm any of it. I wonder if any further records from the workhouse have survived that give more details to help.

Dunno, Gibbo... I have 2 like this in my tree, one is exactly the same set of circumstances and on a main line, because the father wasn't named on the birth cert., virtually no chance of finding who he was

Geoff